Question/saw issue...

[pelligrini]

My first saw was a POS Skill benchtop direct drive. I never really used the OEM guard splitter. It wasn't a true riving knife, and it was an incredible pain to use. Knowing what I know now about table saws and safety, it is a wonder I didn't get seriously hurt with it.

The OEM guard on my BT clone (I now have a craftsman 21829) was much better. I do a lot of thin work and non-through cuts so the guard had to come off a lot. Getting the OEM off and on was a pain to me; 3 or 4 screws for the throat plate, then two nuts for the guard. The Guard would also flop around when I tilted the saw up on the folding stand. It normally got left off.

Then I learned about the Shark. The shark riving knife is always on, except when using a dado or box joint stack. The guard goes on and off so easily too. It is usually on unless I'm doing some work where it can't be. Most of my cutting gets dome outside so I'm not too worried about dust collection. The dust port is more important when I've got the saw set up inside.

I don't like the pawls either. I didn't order my Shark with them. Some guys have wired or permanently taped them up, others have said that some tape over the points have lessened the scratching, but still would help to prevent kickback.

[cwsmith]

I haven't had any problems with the splitter itself, but the anti-kickback device is definitely a PIA. The teeth are very sharp, which I think they need to be, but the spring is much too strong IMHO. As mentioned ealier it really digs into the blade clearance plate, but worse it actually mars your stock.

The spring pressure is such that when the stock passes under the anti-kickback teeth, they actually leave a score mark.

To remedy that on mine, I thought I'd remove the springs and try it that way. But it is not easily done and I was sure it would damage them to the point that I would not get them back on, if it proved necessary.

I had read somewhere, that a remedy was to cut the springs, but I'm not a person who likes to destroy a component in an attempt to improve it... rarely does that work the way I might have hoped.

So, I simply grabbed the spring leg where it rests against the back of the pivoting "pawl" and lifted it up and set it over the top edge of the splitter plate. You need to do that for both the left and the right side.

Once done, there was no spring pressure on the anti-kickback pawls; they just rested against the stock by thier own weight. I figured that should work, as that is all that my anti-kickback pawls do on my RAS and they are significantly smaller. I think the key to thier working is the sharpness and angle of the teeth.

It seems to work very well on my BT, with those springs lifted out of the way, and thus taking pressure off the pawls. The pawls still function, as I've tested by trying to pull the stock back (power off, of course) and the pawls will not allow that.

Without the spring pressure, the pawls no longer press into the stock and those spitefull score marks are now absent. It would be the same as if you had cut the springs, but in this manner they are not destroyed and I can simply lift them off the top of the splitter plate and put them back in their original position, should I have been proven wrong.

I hope this is helpful,

CWS

[steveg]

pelligrini -- thanks for that additional info on the shark guard. Those people need to hire you as a salesman! It absolutely sounds more "user friendly" than the OEM. I'm going to need to consider this, if I begin using this saw semi-regularly...

cwsmith -- seems like you have come up with a very good solution for what seems to be alot of the issue -- those anti-kickback pawls. When I get that blade in the mail, and install it, I'm going to take a close look, and try to see just exactly what you are describing that you did with those springs. I am going to do the same thing you did. If I can't figure it out after looking at the saw, I may have to ask you for a bit more detail, but I think it will be clear what you did, once I look at it.

THANKS for this great suggestion!

Steve

[cabinetman]

When I get that blade in the mail, and install it...
Steve

Seems like you could pick up an equivalent blade (or the same one possibly) at one of the box stores for the same money or less, not pay shipping, and get it right away.

.

[steveg]

cabinetman --

Probably quite true, though I had a list of blades from knottscott that he broke down into categories (decent inexpensive combo blade, premier combo blade, etc.) and when I called my local Lowe's to see if they had a couple of the models knottscott recommended, they didn't. So, since I am not knowledgeable enough to "branch out" and make any blade choices myself, and thus wanted to stick to what was suggested by knottscott, I gave up on finding one locally; since there were some other things I was ordering online, I just added one the suggested blades to the order. It is supposed to be here Friday, so won't be long now...

Steve

[GerryR]

The guard, riving knife assembly and anti-kickback pawls on the new Craftsman version of the Ryiobi B3k are much different than the what has been described here, as far as I can tell. The guard comes off with the push of a button, the pawls, likewise and the riving knife assembly is taken out or adjusted by lifting a lever and maneuvering around a set of pins which hold the assembly in proper perspective.

I had the Ryiobo 10 to 12 years ago, selling it before moving, and don't remember the details exactly. I just got the Craftsman version a couple of weeks ago, and the guard assembly struck me as being much different than what I had rememberd on the Ryiobi. I assume the Craftsman parts would drop in the Ryiobi. It might be another option once you solve the blade problem.

[Cochese]

The guard, riving knife assembly and anti-kickback pawls on the new Craftsman version of the Ryiobi B3k are much different than the what has been described here, as far as I can tell. The guard comes off with the push of a button, the pawls, likewise and the riving knife assembly is taken out or adjusted by lifting a lever and maneuvering around a set of pins which hold the assembly in proper perspective.

I had the Ryiobo 10 to 12 years ago, selling it before moving, and don't remember the details exactly. I just got the Craftsman version a couple of weeks ago, and the guard assembly struck me as being much different than what I had rememberd on the Ryiobi. I assume the Craftsman parts would drop in the Ryiobi. It might be another option once you solve the blade problem.

That's different than the one I bought two years ago then. The guard was integrated to the riving knife, which is why I had to buy a Shark Guard.

[steveg]

Gerry --

Very interesting...

While likely not as nice as the Shark Guard, I wonder if this "new" assembly would be a nice middle ground (price-wise and performance-wise)...

Guess the question becomes what is the price of the part, and will it work on older Craftsman/Ryobi units...

Steve

[GerryR]

New Saw Guard

If you go to Sears Parts Direct and type in 315218291 as "Model Number," it will bring you to the Saw diagrams and parts / price list. Here are some pictures of the guard assembly on mine:













I hope this helps.
Gerry

[pelligrini]

That looks like a big improvement, my 21829 doesn't have a guard like that.

I wonder if it will bolt up to the older saws. I really couldn't tell from the parts diagrams or your photos. Doesn't look like they included a rving knife that isn't taller than the blade though.

[Cochese]

That looks like a big improvement, my 21829 doesn't have a guard like that.

I wonder if it will bolt up to the older saws. I really couldn't tell from the parts diagrams or your photos. Doesn't look like they included a rving knife that isn't taller than the blade though.

The front mounting screw looks like it's moved over to the right side, instead of in the middle. The insert might be able to be modified, but I'm not sure how you'd mount the knife to ours, though.

[GerryR]

That looks like a big improvement, my 21829 doesn't have a guard like that.

I wonder if it will bolt up to the older saws. I really couldn't tell from the parts diagrams or your photos. Doesn't look like they included a riving knife that isn't taller than the blade though.

Lifting the yellow lever, tilting the splitter / riving knife(?), then lowering it to the next set of holes makes it lower than the blade. Push the lever down and it locks it in that position. You can see the second set of holes in the third picture down.

[pelligrini]

Lifting the yellow lever, tilting the splitter / riving knife(?), then lowering it to the next set of holes makes it lower than the blade. Push the lever down and it locks it in that position. You can see the second set of holes in the third picture down.

OK, that's pretty cool. Thanks for the info.
How does the lever assembly attach to the saw/shroud casting? Are there two bolts or screws?

[GerryR]

Two socket Head Cap Screws:

[LCHIEN]

Wow, that's pretty neat. I didn't realize Ryobi had designed a new riving knife mounting and guard and pawl mounting as well. Competes with Shark Guard in some features, but it appears you can't retro fit to the BT3100/BT3000 because the riving knife base mounts with two vertically running bolts instead of horizontally running bolts.