Question/saw issue...

[steveg]

holy COW Tom! You must have the luck of the Irish!

Sounds like some nice upgrades on the new Craftsman saw...VERY nice!

Steve

[tommyt]

Steveg -

Thanks for the kind comments!

Actually, I just picked up what I think is an even better deal. Got the latest Craftsman 21829 for $200 in absolutely new condition. Blade guard, Riving knife and router kit were still in unopened plastic bags! To top it off, the guy threw in a $100 Docis 3.0 cable modem when he heard I needed one. Got to love Craigslist!

I am pretty impressed with the refinements that have been made, and love how easy it is to move with the folding base. Also how throat plate, Riving knife and blade guard attach/adjust without tools. Nice as well to have miter slots on the Accessory table for using some jigs (this table fits the BT3000 and is available at Sears). The Chinese blade, however, is a downgrade. It is sharp, but cuts awful compared to the Porter Cable Razor on other saw. (Found a place locally that has them for $25)

Although I still peek at the app on my phone that finds tool deals (and found more excellent BT3000s for $200 or less) ... I don't plan on buying more. Two guys after one of the BT3000s (will let go for $150), so I will have $250 into the saw purchases, or less if you figure in the modem I needed to buy.

Tom

[steveg]

hey tommyt --

FIRST off, I am SO envious that you nabbed a nearly unused BT3K for FIFTY BUCKS?? I thought I did pretty good to get mine at $150...

But yeah, that's a great post -- in that you were able to see, on TWO saws, the effects of a dull blade, EVEN one that doesn't look or FEEL dull. With that new Freud Fusion blade, my saw is, LITERALLY, a different machine. I can't WAIT to use it now; I just bought the oak lumber today for the trim carpentry project, and I'm looking forward to it now (whereas, I was DREADING it, before, based on the way my saw was behaving and fearing that I was going to have to buy another saw...)

cwsmith -- I think my local Sears is more similar to what yours is now; and I agree with you in your answer to kramer katt that there very well COULD be an old model on the floor. I went in yesterday, just to see if by some stroke of luck I could get a wrench for my arbor (but knowing that it was a snowball's chance). SO, them not having it was not the issue, it was the general lack of knowledge of anyone there, w.r.t. the saws. When I told them I was looking for a wrench for my Craftsman table saw arbor, a sales guy took me back to the combination wrenches...didn't even have a clue that such a wrench wouldn't work. I was surprised at that...

Steve

[cwsmith]

Would Sears really keep an out of date model on the sales floor?

YEP!

All too much depends on the hardware manager of course. My FIL, when he was the hardware manager in the Binghamton-area store, was the top HW manager on the east coast. Kept all of his people right up to date on every tool and everything was not only in working order, but clean and well maintained and even polished. After his retirement, he couldn't bear to even visit the store... bins empty, displays disorganized, tools missing parts and neglected.

The two Sears that I occasionally visit are that way. More sales people than customers and everything in the stationary tool display is crowded together, missing parts, tops corroded, and not a soul there that can begin to discuss the nature of any of the tools. Rather shameful I think, but apparently Sears doesn't care.

CWS

[kramer katt]

sears clone

was at the local Sears yesterday and walked past the big power tool display.
Remembering this discussion I went over closer to the Sears BT clone they
had and was surprised to see that old type blade guard/ slitter
How recently was the changed made at Ryobi?
Would Sears really keep an out of date model on the sales floor?

[tommyt]

My blade experience

I am a newbie but have a story that might help. A contractor friend impressed me his BT3000 so when my cast-iron monstrosity started being a pain, I started looking on Craigslist. I missed a few, drove 100 miles see one for $100 that looked awful, then finally found a nice one for $150. I put a Porter Cable Razor 50 tooth blade on it and was amazed how well it cut. Effortlessly, and with glue-ready surfaces.

3 days later, I saw another BT3K for sale that said it was nearly unused - - for $50! At that price I could have one in the basement and one in the shed! I bought it, and it really was nearly unused, even had the original blade that felt really sharp. But, I thought it was defective when I tried to rip. Motor really bogged. Two days later, I tried an experiment and took the bogging blade and put it on my 1st saw - it bogged too! Wow, the problem was just the blade. Interestingly, I had it hooked up to my Kill-a-watt meter and it showed it was drawing 13+ amps with the old blade but only 8 with the new one.

Really liking the saws, especially now that I have learned to align them. A jig with a dial indicator sure makes it a much easier job!

[steveg]

LCHIEN --

I'll definitely check those options out...

Also found a few places that seem like they may do such service, a "honing" company that is listed under "sharpening..." Looks like I have some options.

Steve

[LCHIEN]

check with the guys at the sercice desk at HD or Lowes, they may have the local service pick up. Ace hardware, Tru-Value, sears hardware, Sears Outlet all had the same service picking up locally.

[steveg]

LCHIEN --

Thanks for the info on the sharpening...we don't have a "local hardware store" in my town; it's just Lowe's and Home Depot. Looks like a few possible options in a nearby city, though, from what I can tell. Thanks for that...and for the link to Forrest Blades. Another option for me.

On the wrenches, I'll check the FAQ...

Thanks!

Steve

[LCHIEN]

Top cote is really a waste on a an aluminum saw... its for cast iron tables mosstly as an anti-rust treatment.

In my area, many hardware stores have at their service desk, a list of sharpening services - for carbide blades, scissors, lawnmower blades, knives axes, etc. Just ask them, they usually send it to a third party that picks up and delivers once a week. or look in the yellow pages under sharpening. (my YP has two categories - Saw sharpening and repairing and Sharpening services)..The other option is to mail it away to a service. I have used http://www.forrestblades.com/sharpprice.htm - their blades are super excellent and apparently so is their sharpening.

Look in the BT3 FAQ for arbor wrench info

[steveg]

Guys --

I posted a reply the other day, but it did not make it to the forum.

I decided on some Johnson's wax for now, as I was at Lowe's today. Haven't applied it yet, but I understand that none on the SMT fence makes sense! I will look at getting a can of that top cote, also.

I will wax the table top and the rip fence face...any advice as to how to apply/wipe off the stuff? Just buff it in, and then rub it off?

My fence seems to slide fine, so don't think I need to treat the rails in any way with wax paper or anything.

I can't wait to try it after waxing...that, and the new blade, and it's going to feel like a completely different machine!

I guess I need to fish that old OEM Freud blade out of the trash; didn't know you could get the teeth sharpened, and it would be good to have that blade as a backup. Where would I even begin to look, to find a place who would sharpen it?

Finally, I went to Sears today, to buy the wrench that holds the arbor, while trying to remove the arbor nut to replace a blade. My saw didn't come with any of the wrenches. Normal combination wrenches work fine for the rest of the stuff (arbor nut, etc.), but not to hold the arbor -- a normal combination wrench won't fit. As I figured, they don't sell them in the store...so I guess I'll need to order one online. Any idea who has a decent price without paying outrageous shipping? I've found the wrenches at some places for just a few bucks, but they want like $10 to $12 to ship them! I could do without, as sticking a piece of wood against the teeth works fine for removing the nut; but, holding onto the blade with a thick leather glove while tightening the arbor nut -- though it works OK -- is not ideal! I guess I could try the "grind down a combination wrench" trick, but...

Steve

[cwsmith]

DON'T use car wax! As the other members have said, it will lead to finishing problems. The silicone also seems to find itself drifting to places you swear you hadn't touched.

I use Butcher's as it smells less than the Johnson's... but I don't know who carries that any more. I bought a couple of cans for next to nothing when HD clearanced it a few years ago... and I haven't seen it since.

ONLY wax the top and the side of the rip fence. Basically all you are looking for is a dry lube of the surfaces on which you will be sliding the stock. That does NOT include the SMT fence... you need all the friction there that you can get there, so no wax!

I used an old candle to "lube" the rails, but do this ONLY if the fence drags, and then only on the edges where the rip fence with slide, which is those two track-like surfaces on either side of the channel. For me, I only did the surfaces to the right of the blade, which is where my rip fence mostly resides. Don't do the inside and outside of those rail areas... that's where you want the accessory table and the SMT to lock... if you wax those surfaces, that locking action will be difficult.

Glad to see your new blade alleviated the problems you were challenged with,

CWS

[pelligrini]

I believe he's got the Italian made OEM blade still. It is worth getting it sharpened.

HD and Lowes carry Johnsons in the cleaning goods area, Minwax is by the stains. I couldn't find the Johnsons when I first looked for wax, so I ended up with a can of Minwax.

Don't wax the rails, as it can lead to clamping issues with the fence. If your fence isn't sliding easily, a quick rub on the rails with wax paper can help. I wax the top, fence face, accessory tables and throat plate. I also like a light application to the SMT where the top slides on, sometimes it's just a rub with wax paper. Wax buildup in the guides is something you don't want. Don't wax the SMT fence either, that's not a bright idea.

If you haven't done it yet, you will really notice a big difference.

[LCHIEN]

Never use car wax, most all car waxes contain silicone additives which will contaminate your wood and make it impossible to finish - you get these fisheyes that don't take finish.

Use Johnson's paste wax or Minwax paste wax or Butcher's wax - these are known to be 100% wax. The Johnson's can be found with the floor care stuff in Lowes and HD, or often grocery stores as well. Minwax is often found with the furniture finishing stuff.

glad to hear a new blade did it for you. Carbide saw Blades can be sharpened at a cost (around $0.30 per tooth) usually much less than new blade... you may want to consider sharpening you old blade as a backup or if its not a good blade then buy a backup when they go on sale which is sharp and a reference for when you need to sharpen your main blade.

[cabinetman]

SUCCESS!!


I did notice that there is still some "stickiness" or "friction" between the wood and the saw when pushing the wood through, but this time, it's clear this has nothing to do with the blade. The cutting is fine, as I said; I can tell now that the only thing left for me to do is to wax the table (and maybe the fence?) So, for those of you that have done this, do you wax both the tabletop AND the face of the rip fence? Do you use just a normal car wax?

Thanks -- and thanks for everyone's help w.r.t. troubleshooting my problem. It's solved now!

Steve

I had my bet on the blade. Congrats. As for waxing the saw top, I don't recommend it if you plan on doing finishing in the area, or to the wood that gets cut. I may sound anal about it, but think about what wax does. I would recommend Top Cote. IMO, it works better and longer than wax.

.