The title is kind of self explanatory, but let's face some facts.
MOST, but not all of us that are using some sort of dust collector, are using some kind of small 110v collector, and the most popular it seems is the cheap Harbor Freight 2HP dust collector that we all acknowledge is less than ideal, but is being pressed into service anyway.
We make do the best we can with our 2HP motors by installing the largest impellers that will fit (Wen or Rikon 12" possibly others), adding some sort of separator, and swapping out the dust pump bag filter for a MERV15 pleated filter like the Wynn...
We add some method of separating fines / chips so they don't clog up the filter quite so fast, and we make our runs as short, smooth, and straight as physically possible in order to keep from taking too big of a hit to our airflow.
But is it enough?
To be blunt. NO IT IS NOT.
If most dust and chips collected is our goal, then 4" will work, but oh so just barely.
5" is better, but we have gone on at length about the issues getting 5" parts.
6" is even better, but we are running into the limits of the ability of our blowers to actually move that much air.
7" hits the sweet spot, but as we all know, odd number sizes are VERY difficult to get parts for, or at the least incredibly expensive.
So what's the solution?
Well the claim is buy once cry once. I am not sure I agree. My argument is if you have to wait to buy the best, you may never get the chance to even get started.
There is wisdom in both approaches. And drawbacks.
Simply put, We need bigger blowers. MUCH bigger blowers. WIth higher CFM blowers, your duct CFM will remain up, with a smaller duct size. But don't get too enthusiastic.
Something to keep in mind, when I tested and calcualted CFM of my post Wen impeller swap through my former Thien 5" separator / drum, and 24" of 5" ribbed hose, I ended up with a calculation of around 768cfm at the 5" inlet of the Thien.
Further research shows Thien separators take a steep hit on CFM of around 43-48%, knowing the leaks mine had, and the ribbed hose. I am going to say 48% just for kicks and grins. That means eliminate the ribbed hose, done, eliminate the barrel separator, done, use a neutral vane that in theory should have no airflow impacts, done, and my CFM at my inlet is unmeasureable by my Anemometer.
If anyone has a higher speed reading Anemometer that is willing to loan to me for testing, I will fill in that info when done. If you are somewhat local, we can even do the old college beer loan method! (you loan me the anemometer, I use it while we drink beer)...
Digression set aside though. Do I think I am going to get 1K CFM at the end of a 20' run of 5" using my HF 2HP DC, even modded?
Nope.
I wish, but no, I am more realistic than that.
Do I think 6" would have done the trick?
Maybe, but nope. WIth the increase in duct size, comes an increase in CFM, but a decrease in static pressure, so the tradeoff wouldn't be worth it. I think...
So what then?
Well obviously bigger motor and impeller right?
To be blunt, 2HP is about the max you are going to run on 110v, so you'll need a 220v outlet, and 3HP and up dust collectors tend to be TALL cyclones.
This brings me to the other major problem. Space.
My workshop is a garage workshop, with 8' celings, barely.
Many of the big 3+ HP cyclone rigs are simply too tall for my space.
And what about the folks in basement shops with even less headroom?
Or the guys working in sheds?
Mind you, I think there are solutions, but again they are big, and that is the double bagger units like the Shop Fox 3HP W1687 with a listed wishful CFM of 2830 but filtration listed at a VERY dangerous 30 microns. You'd need to definately add dual cartridge filters!
So the solution I am going with, for better or worse, and I am 100% aware this is less than perfect, but is is what I can manage...
Maximilze the performance of the existing 2HP dust collector. I have it, it works with my available power, it fits in my available space.
Reduce or eliminate any impediments to dust collector and duct performance. In progress by straightening out runs, eliminating as many bends and as much hose as possible. etc...
fix duct sizes as best I can, but there are a LOT of ducts I just can't fix. I.E. the Rigid Oscillating spindle / belt sander. I can fork a 4" and a 2.5" off of a 5" main, but that still won't guarantee fully picked up fine dust...
USE A RESPIRATOR! Been doing that for years. And while I don't use it as often as I should I use it ANY TIME I work with any woods I know are reactive like Walnut...
Install and use an ambient air cleaner. My Grizzly G0572 lives on the ceiling and takes no floor space, runs on readily available 110v power, and is high enough off the ground I don's smash my dome into it. All good. PLUS it assists in moving heated or cooled air around the shop maintaining a more constant temperature and humidity in the shop.
Is my solution ideal?
Nope. Not even close...
But let's say for example finances weren't a concern. And I could afford a ClearVue CV1950 for example. Now they don't list the dimensions, but looking at the pic, and realizing the dust bin they show is a 55 gallon steel drum, thus I can measure distances of the pic, and come up with a height of around 9 feet. Meaning without any way to move the dust bin out from under it, I would have to basically smash a hole into my attic to fit this thing. Not gonna happen.
But let's say magically my ceilings grew to 10' bippity boppity boo...
This machine requires 8" mains, no problem, but. my biggest machien ports are 4". Now we have a problem.
And this is a recurring problem.
Table saw, router table both 4"
Lathe and drill press can be anything, but imagine trying to work around an 8" dust port on a drill press table drilling small parts. Hmmmm....
Okay let's look at other tools.
Rigid sander, 2.5" port, Benchtop jointer, 2.5" port, benchtop planer, 2.5" port, band saw, 2@ 2.5" ports but that can change...
Now I think we see where the culprit really is, and where our biggest problems are.
our dust ports.
My table saw has a 4" port because a 4" port was added to my table saw, not because it came with it. and that is on the belly pan. The blade guard has a 4" port because I got a Shark Guard with said 4" port. The blade shroud has a 2.5" factory port that I seriously doubt can be ugraded without major sheet metal surgery.
All in all, I think the point I am trying to make here is this...
We can fuss and fret all we want about DC motor power, / impeller sizes, and to an extent that is valid. Duct sizing should be considered absolutely, but until we can manage to properly upsize our dust ports, we are really not capturing all of the fine dust. Even with the big 5HP cyclones and huge mains.
You need that something else. You need the respirator and air cleaner to help keep up with the job at hand...
And in the vein of making sure our port sizes are large enough for the task at hand, I will be asking a LOT of questions that may not be able to be answered, but I am hoping to stir up some thought and creative solutions to a problem we all face...
MOST, but not all of us that are using some sort of dust collector, are using some kind of small 110v collector, and the most popular it seems is the cheap Harbor Freight 2HP dust collector that we all acknowledge is less than ideal, but is being pressed into service anyway.
We make do the best we can with our 2HP motors by installing the largest impellers that will fit (Wen or Rikon 12" possibly others), adding some sort of separator, and swapping out the dust pump bag filter for a MERV15 pleated filter like the Wynn...
We add some method of separating fines / chips so they don't clog up the filter quite so fast, and we make our runs as short, smooth, and straight as physically possible in order to keep from taking too big of a hit to our airflow.
But is it enough?
To be blunt. NO IT IS NOT.
If most dust and chips collected is our goal, then 4" will work, but oh so just barely.
5" is better, but we have gone on at length about the issues getting 5" parts.
6" is even better, but we are running into the limits of the ability of our blowers to actually move that much air.
7" hits the sweet spot, but as we all know, odd number sizes are VERY difficult to get parts for, or at the least incredibly expensive.
So what's the solution?
Well the claim is buy once cry once. I am not sure I agree. My argument is if you have to wait to buy the best, you may never get the chance to even get started.
There is wisdom in both approaches. And drawbacks.
Simply put, We need bigger blowers. MUCH bigger blowers. WIth higher CFM blowers, your duct CFM will remain up, with a smaller duct size. But don't get too enthusiastic.
Something to keep in mind, when I tested and calcualted CFM of my post Wen impeller swap through my former Thien 5" separator / drum, and 24" of 5" ribbed hose, I ended up with a calculation of around 768cfm at the 5" inlet of the Thien.
Further research shows Thien separators take a steep hit on CFM of around 43-48%, knowing the leaks mine had, and the ribbed hose. I am going to say 48% just for kicks and grins. That means eliminate the ribbed hose, done, eliminate the barrel separator, done, use a neutral vane that in theory should have no airflow impacts, done, and my CFM at my inlet is unmeasureable by my Anemometer.
If anyone has a higher speed reading Anemometer that is willing to loan to me for testing, I will fill in that info when done. If you are somewhat local, we can even do the old college beer loan method! (you loan me the anemometer, I use it while we drink beer)...
Digression set aside though. Do I think I am going to get 1K CFM at the end of a 20' run of 5" using my HF 2HP DC, even modded?
Nope.
I wish, but no, I am more realistic than that.
Do I think 6" would have done the trick?
Maybe, but nope. WIth the increase in duct size, comes an increase in CFM, but a decrease in static pressure, so the tradeoff wouldn't be worth it. I think...
So what then?
Well obviously bigger motor and impeller right?
To be blunt, 2HP is about the max you are going to run on 110v, so you'll need a 220v outlet, and 3HP and up dust collectors tend to be TALL cyclones.
This brings me to the other major problem. Space.
My workshop is a garage workshop, with 8' celings, barely.
Many of the big 3+ HP cyclone rigs are simply too tall for my space.
And what about the folks in basement shops with even less headroom?
Or the guys working in sheds?
Mind you, I think there are solutions, but again they are big, and that is the double bagger units like the Shop Fox 3HP W1687 with a listed wishful CFM of 2830 but filtration listed at a VERY dangerous 30 microns. You'd need to definately add dual cartridge filters!
So the solution I am going with, for better or worse, and I am 100% aware this is less than perfect, but is is what I can manage...
Maximilze the performance of the existing 2HP dust collector. I have it, it works with my available power, it fits in my available space.
Reduce or eliminate any impediments to dust collector and duct performance. In progress by straightening out runs, eliminating as many bends and as much hose as possible. etc...
fix duct sizes as best I can, but there are a LOT of ducts I just can't fix. I.E. the Rigid Oscillating spindle / belt sander. I can fork a 4" and a 2.5" off of a 5" main, but that still won't guarantee fully picked up fine dust...
USE A RESPIRATOR! Been doing that for years. And while I don't use it as often as I should I use it ANY TIME I work with any woods I know are reactive like Walnut...
Install and use an ambient air cleaner. My Grizzly G0572 lives on the ceiling and takes no floor space, runs on readily available 110v power, and is high enough off the ground I don's smash my dome into it. All good. PLUS it assists in moving heated or cooled air around the shop maintaining a more constant temperature and humidity in the shop.
Is my solution ideal?
Nope. Not even close...
But let's say for example finances weren't a concern. And I could afford a ClearVue CV1950 for example. Now they don't list the dimensions, but looking at the pic, and realizing the dust bin they show is a 55 gallon steel drum, thus I can measure distances of the pic, and come up with a height of around 9 feet. Meaning without any way to move the dust bin out from under it, I would have to basically smash a hole into my attic to fit this thing. Not gonna happen.
But let's say magically my ceilings grew to 10' bippity boppity boo...
This machine requires 8" mains, no problem, but. my biggest machien ports are 4". Now we have a problem.
And this is a recurring problem.
Table saw, router table both 4"
Lathe and drill press can be anything, but imagine trying to work around an 8" dust port on a drill press table drilling small parts. Hmmmm....
Okay let's look at other tools.
Rigid sander, 2.5" port, Benchtop jointer, 2.5" port, benchtop planer, 2.5" port, band saw, 2@ 2.5" ports but that can change...
Now I think we see where the culprit really is, and where our biggest problems are.
our dust ports.
My table saw has a 4" port because a 4" port was added to my table saw, not because it came with it. and that is on the belly pan. The blade guard has a 4" port because I got a Shark Guard with said 4" port. The blade shroud has a 2.5" factory port that I seriously doubt can be ugraded without major sheet metal surgery.
All in all, I think the point I am trying to make here is this...
We can fuss and fret all we want about DC motor power, / impeller sizes, and to an extent that is valid. Duct sizing should be considered absolutely, but until we can manage to properly upsize our dust ports, we are really not capturing all of the fine dust. Even with the big 5HP cyclones and huge mains.
You need that something else. You need the respirator and air cleaner to help keep up with the job at hand...
And in the vein of making sure our port sizes are large enough for the task at hand, I will be asking a LOT of questions that may not be able to be answered, but I am hoping to stir up some thought and creative solutions to a problem we all face...
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