Dust collection. Are we fooling ourselves?

[dbhost]

f#$%ing Google Photos!

Sorry, they show up for me but I guess. Heck I am just going to upload them here. Give me a few to fix this...

[capncarl]

I think the sawdust that comes up on the table saw mostly happens as the blade cuts thru a longer cut and starts to cut a wider kerf on its upward rotation. It may be due to the blade slightly out of align with the rip fence or jig or could be blade wobble. Anyway, it does happen, and unless it is captured it is spewed into the air.
I like the shark guard hose hook up. So far the only thing I found with the SawStop I didn’t like was the hose fitting for the blade guard ( I don’t think they call it a guard) it has 1.5” hose connection! That would choke a respectable shop vacuum down! 1.5” hose should be reserved for cleaning the ashtrays on a car! Not a dust collector!

[dbhost]

I'm pretty sure they make a Shark Guard for a SawStop... And yeah, since they are such a safety oriented company it seems kind of insane that they use such a small "dust collection port". I have a special wishlist on Amazon that is for pipe dream / post lotto win or at least post getting out of debt stuff. A SawStop 3HP PCS and Shark Guard for it are on the list...

[capncarl]

Previously mentioned, larger dust collectors were for Big shops. That is not entirely correct, Describe Big shops? I describe a big shop as one that has employees, an does some volume of work. The 5hp cyclones could be used in Big shops but that would likely resemble us using the 2 hp HF bag unit with a filter. Big shops that utilize several table saws, jointer, planer and lots of sanding will likely have 20 hp units with 16’ tall cyclones and seldom utilize filters unless they are required to by local requirements.
The 5hp cyclones are targeted at hobby wood shops that feel the need for more dust control than a 2hp unit.

[LCHIEN]

By big shops I mean the kind where more than one large dustmaker is apt to be on at the same time - that usually means where there is more than one woodworker, possibly a crew of several.
5 HP units would be for shops where maybe two guys are working or perhaps for the well heeled single operator who wants to really keep his shop clean. And there are much larger units for factories and wood mills with multiples of machinery.

[Jim Frye]

The dust port on my bandsaw is located at the bottom "front" of the cabinet. The 2 1/2" port catches almost everything the blade produces. I occasionally open the door and vac out what little dust accumulates in the upper regions of the blade path. Oddly enough, the tire wiper never has much of anything on it.

[dbhost]

Some, but sadly very few, of the 14" cast iron frame bandsaws have this configuration, and those that do, work well..

[LCHIEN]

I think the sawdust that comes up on the table saw mostly happens as the blade cuts thru a longer cut and starts to cut a wider kerf on its upward rotation. It may be due to the blade slightly out of align with the rip fence or jig or could be blade wobble. Anyway, it does happen, and unless it is captured it is spewed into the air.
I like the shark guard hose hook up. So far the only thing I found with the SawStop I didn’t like was the hose fitting for the blade guard ( I don’t think they call it a guard) it has 1.5” hose connection! That would choke a respectable shop vacuum down! 1.5” hose should be reserved for cleaning the ashtrays on a car! Not a dust collector!

Reread my post #1.0 in this thread. I added the calculation of acceleration flinging the particles off the saw blade as it rotates down from the cut and its about 90 G's. Not many particles are going to be coming up and around. Very little cutting if any on a properly tuned saw should be happening on the upgoing side of the blade, but virtually all on the down cutting side at the front.

[capncarl]

Agreed, but that still doesn’t explain the sawdust in front of my table saw!

[capncarl]

I’ve been considering replacing the blade guard/dust collector (it’s only 2 months old and probably the worst engineered thing on the SawStop). I was looking at the guard to see if the 1.5 inch vacuum cleaner hose could be replaced with 2.5” hose. Not possible. Then I noticed that the dang thing is stopped up, it looks like several toothpicks got tangled up in the inlet and cause a blockage. That may be the reason sawdust is on the floor in front of my saw. Now to get up enough enthusiasm to throw away a new $150.00 guard and buy a $250.00 guard.

[dbhost]

Maybe a dumb question, but.... The Ryobi AP1301 planer I have has a 2.5" dust port. Is there a replacement that fits and works that will give me a 4" port?

[Jim Frye]

Maybe a dumb question, but.... The Ryobi AP1301 planer I have has a 2.5" dust port. Is there a replacement that fits and works that will give me a 4" port?

I have a 1300 model and this is the chip port that came with it. The big hole is 4" OD, but the opening is 2 1/2", so the 4" is just an adapter. I don't recall ever seeing any other one for these.

[capncarl]

I believe the Dewalt 735 has a simular port to this! Could the internal fan be faulty, broken vanes etc?

[dbhost]

Capncarl, when hooked to a shop vac, it works fine, when hooked to the DC it works fine, when hooked to the shop vac via ducting it jammed up. The AP1301 doesn't have a blower that I know of. It has the 2.5 inch port that side exits like what Jim posts, OR there is a flip open chute that will puke shavings straight out of the back of the machine. What that tells me right or wrong is that the 2.5" port is kind of at its limit when it does work. Just looking at possible options. Again trying to maximize efficiency of the system particularly at machine collection.

[capncarl]

Looks to be the same planer with a Craftsman Badge, it did have a fan, may have been the same fan as the motor cooling fan. It could have shed a blade or two and impedes the discharge. When operating properly it would spray sawdust like a show blower when not hooked up to dust collection.

[Jim Frye]

I've not had clogging issues with the 2 1/2" port and my ShopVacs, but I usually take light cuts, 1/8" at most usually and not more than 8" in width. I've always worried more about tearout than clogging. If I have a big reduction to do, I usually resaw down to near the final thickness and then plane to final.

[dbhost]

If you are going 1/8 at a time you are WAY more aggressive than my cuts, but I will go the full 13" width if need be. But take at most 1/16" passes. Never been comfortable chomping off 1/8 or more...

[capncarl]

One benefit of owning a large dust collector is not just point of use collection, it’s whole shop air cleaning. My shop is 750 square feet with 10 ft ceilings, so it’s volume is 7500 cubic feet. The ClearVue CV1800 with the optional larger fan wheel boasts between 1000 to 1500 cubic feet/minute, depending on whom, where and how it’s measured. So besides the collection of dust at the machines, it is filtering my whole shop air through .5 micron filters between every 4 1/2 to 7 minutes. The whole point is to clean the shop air of dangerous wood fiber dust. With the pitiful consumer grade dust collection ports on my equipment I’m not as concerned with some large pieces of sawdust on the floor as long as I’m not seeing flour dust everywhere like it use to be.

As others have recommended, the equipment with shop vacuum ports need shop vacs not necked down cyclones, even if it takes a shop vacuum setting under every machine!

[dbhost]

Not sure if it was this thread or another one, but to reiterate. The planer, and jointer both have 2.5" dust ports, and when run through a shop vac via a shop vac ducted system which for some reason SV ships out 2" tubing, honestly they should fit the blast gates for 2.5" adapters on one side and 3" PVC on the other, that is actually pretty common, but I digress. When run through a shop vac configuration it jams up, when run via a funnel reducer to 4" ducted dust collector, it clears super easy, never a problem.

Knowing that, I think the Rigid Sander needs a shop vac for sure just to make sure it has enough force to suck the vacuum to suck the dust INTO the housing in the first place....

You probably are right and I am betting the planer and jointer would work just as well, or better with a shop vac and no ducting / being necked down to 2", but noise levels wise, the shop vac is a LOT louder than the DC... Like shreiking ex mother in law loud...

[capncarl]

The problem I see with using shop vac’s everywhere in the shop is the filters. These things are barely one step above the belching bag filters on small dust collectors, so you are not accomplishing much your lungs by using them. Now if you fitted those shop vacs with HEPA filters.

[dbhost]

HEPA filter, and Thien separator. Yep.

[Carlos]

I upgraded to a 3 HP Powermatic a long time ago. Huge thing. What an improvement, but so loud, and used up SO much room. It was a double bag/filter unit. Then some years ago I built a 3HP system from a used motor/impeller, a used steel cyclone, and housed it in a shed outside. Noise gone. Dust gone. No filters. I absolutely love it. The huge bin need emptying about once a year. The saved space became a fantastic clamp rack with sheet storage behind it, and a tool shelf with pegboard behind it.

[dbhost]

If I had ANY inkling I could get away with space wise, and afford the machine itself and the 30 amp 220V outlet I would have gone with 6" duct instead of 5. And just go with a Super Dust Deputy XL to get the job done, With a stacked filter setup. I can't exhaust outside as I am in the garage, brick walls, HOA etc...

[Carlos]

That's the cyclone I got, at the local used woodworking tool trader. The HOA is fine here, sheds just have to be below fence line or be made to match the house. I was able to stay below the fence. Never seen.

You can drill brick!

Oh, and Oneida told me NOT to do 6" feeds in the shop. They said 5" backbone, dropping to 4 close to the tool. Works very well.

[dbhost]

That's the cyclone I got, at the local used woodworking tool trader. The HOA is fine here, sheds just have to be below fence line or be made to match the house. I was able to stay below the fence. Never seen.

You can drill brick!

Oh, and Oneida told me NOT to do 6" feeds in the shop. They said 5" backbone, dropping to 4 close to the tool. Works very well.

That's what I did, 5" mains dropping to 4" closest to the tool...