Header Ad

Collapse

Arbor nuts.

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Arbor nuts.

    I am thinking of buying a spare arbor nut. As usual I am thinking too much. I was thinking if I dropped my Arbor nut in this mess of a shop what would I do if I could not find it? So I am thinking about buying a spare arbor nut. Usually according to Murphy's law this would work pretty well. Murphy's law says that parts for which you have spares will never break or get lost. Which has worked for me mostly and is a fine and dandy concept... along the lines of if you carry an umbrella with you it will not rain on that occasion.

    Of course the corollary to Murphy is that more than likely you have bought the wrong items as spares.

    Nonetheless I have digressed,

    To me the classic arbor nut for a right tilt table saw is the 5/8"-12 Acme (square profile, not "V") thread left-handed nut. A odd beast (since ANSI SAE 5/8" threads are 11 and 18 TPI) and of course virtually all right-handed.

    Also, 5/8" bolts and nuts in ANSI std sizes take 15/16th wrench; but Arbor nuts are thin, and take 3/4" wrench.

    So is this true of the BT3000 and almost all 10" table saws, that they have this odd arbor nut?
    Is it the same for most all 10" miter saws as well? Do they share the same arbor nut?

    Does anyone know where I can get one cheaply and easily?
    Last edited by LCHIEN; 02-02-2021, 07:47 PM.
    Loring in Katy, TX USA
    If your only tool is a hammer, you tend to treat all problems as if they were nails.
    BT3 FAQ - https://www.sawdustzone.org/forum/di...sked-questions

  • #2
    Buy a metal detector to hunt for goodies in the sawdust!


    My grizzly lathe has an 11 TPI thread on the head stock end for a hand crank. It is the same as one of Jets lathe too. The G0462 Grizzly came without a hand crank, so I ordered one from Jet. It fit, but I thought 11TPI was weird too. I don't remember the diameter of the shaft.


    OT but related to "dropping the nut"
    Most people who turn pens use a "mandrel" to hold the pen blank that is being turned. But, for a two part pen (upper and lower pieces) there is usually two spacers, a wood blank, a spacer, 2nd wood blank, two spacers and then the nut. SIX pieces - in which I dropped at least one every other time. And they didn't just fall straight down. They bounced around like tennis balls.

    A metal detector would not have helped until I had lost about 15 or so, and by then it would probably find 1. BTW, - although there was another primary reason I stopped using mandrels, it sure was nice not having to look for dropped spacers on a daily basis.
    Hank Lee

    Experience is what you get when you don't get what you wanted!

    Comment


    • #3
      Ever since I bought my BT3K, I've fretted about the arbor nut. I've dropped it several times mounting/dismounting a blade. Every time, it is has either fallen into the shroud or down into the "belly pan". Both places are easy searches. The "belly pan" thus serves two functions. My greatest fear has always been screwing up the threads by cross threading something. You do raise a good question. The arbor nut is about the only part I haven't duplicated to have on hand, although I could always rob the unused BT3100 for one if needed. OK, here's another fret source to consider. The threaded holes in the main table for the throat plates. I have studiously treated these holes like they were some sort of shrines when I change blades. I keep them lubricated and tenderly tighten the screws gently. When I insert one, I turn it backwards until it drops off of the threads so I know the threads are aligned properly. Paranoia is so much fun.
      Last edited by Jim Frye; 02-02-2021, 10:51 PM.
      Jim Frye
      The Nut in the Cellar.
      ”Sawdust Is Man Glitter”

      Comment


      • #4
        Throat plate threaded holes are easy. 10-24 UNC thread.
        If you strip them they are aluminum and can be repaired with a heli-coil or inserts or you can drill them to the next larger size (1/4-20) and up the screw sizes.
        Loring in Katy, TX USA
        If your only tool is a hammer, you tend to treat all problems as if they were nails.
        BT3 FAQ - https://www.sawdustzone.org/forum/di...sked-questions

        Comment


        • #5
          Finding (arbor nut) it in the bottom of the BT3 blade shroud would be relatively easy - I have a magnetic telescoping retriever in the "basket" of goodies on the table nearby.

          Finding it in the dust collector or multiple hoses with several years of sawdust might be hard if it got sucked up but probably unlikely as its not running when the nut is off.

          What I'm scared of is dropping it on the floor and having it roll under something or behind something. Or fall in one of the holes of the black rubber mat and go hiding. At my age I am not fond of getting down on the cluttered floor and playing hide and seek with a nut that has infinite patience.
          Loring in Katy, TX USA
          If your only tool is a hammer, you tend to treat all problems as if they were nails.
          BT3 FAQ - https://www.sawdustzone.org/forum/di...sked-questions

          Comment


          • #6
            I googled Ryobi table saw arbor nut and Www.fix.com has them for other Ryobi table saws for $3.99. Takes 15/16 arbor wrench. Probably the same nut.

            Comment


            • LCHIEN
              LCHIEN commented
              Editing a comment
              I know that the arbor nut supplied with the BT3000 takes a 3/4" wrench. But its possible to have a large nut with the same internal thread and work fine.

          • #7
            I don't drop my arbor nut anymore because I use a finger magnet:

            Click image for larger version

Name:	finger magnet.png
Views:	76
Size:	187.5 KB
ID:	842694

            Comment


            • #8
              Losing or messing up the thread on an arbor nut is not something that I've ever given any thought too. Actually, I didn't give thought that it might be something that would be hard to replace. Shame on me I suppose, but that's something I guess I should consider purchasing as a backup. Ignorance perhaps, but I thought 10-inch blade arbors would be the same across the industry. Of course having a CMS should have told me different, because it uses a bolt.

              My BT3100 just refers to the arbor nut as a "hex nut 5/8-18" and my BTS-21 calls it a "blade nut 5/8-18"; better than my Craftsman RAS which just calls it "nut, shaft". At another point in the RAS manual it refers to the arbor as being 5/8". I have to see if any of those are interchangeable. The only one that I have a back up for is the RAS, go figure!

              While I've changed blades countless times over the decades, I don't recall ever dropping or misplacing my RAS arbor nut. Where's it going to go, it's only a few inches to the table. The BT3100 I've had since 2005 and probably only have changed the blade a few times. Usually, like with the RAS, the last few turns is done with my fingers, so losing or dropping it hasn't happened yet. But again, where's it going to go, into the dust shroud?

              I don't sit hardware anywhere for more than a few minutes. I learned early that it's too easy to knock or brush off the table, un-noticed until it's needed again. So, I usually just put the nuts, screws, etc. back where they belong as I work on the un-mounted part that needs them.

              Those pesky clearance plate mounting screws, I keep those in a small plastic bottle, right there with the saw. I learned that lesson a few years ago when I wanted to use my zero-clearance plate and couldn't remember that absolutely "safe place that I'll remember". I did find them a couple of weeks later, but for that particular time I raided my plastic storage drawers where I keep a small inventory nuts, bolts, and screws.

              CWS
              Think it Through Before You Do!

              Comment


              • LCHIEN
                LCHIEN commented
                Editing a comment
                throat plate screws: 10-24 x 3/4" flat head machine screws, easily found in any hardware store carrying US-spec hardware.

            • #9
              Originally posted by cwsmith View Post
              I don't sit hardware anywhere for more than a few minutes. I learned early that it's too easy to knock or brush off the table, un-noticed until it's needed again. So, I usually just put the nuts, screws, etc. back where they belong as I work on the un-mounted part that needs them.

              Those pesky clearance plate mounting screws, I keep those in a small plastic bottle, right there with the saw. I learned that lesson a few years ago when I wanted to use my zero-clearance plate and couldn't remember that absolutely "safe place that I'll remember". I did find them a couple of weeks later, but for that particular time I raided my plastic storage drawers where I keep a small inventory nuts, bolts, and screws.

              CWS
              I made a plywood box insert that fit inside my BT3000's factory stand; the box in turn has three drawers in it. One rule of mine is ANYTHING small (bolts, blade spacer rings, throat plates) not actually mounted to the saw goes into the upper drawer for safekeeping. Those pieces only sit "on top of the saw" if they're out only momentarily during blade changes. I too have a few plastic bottles with extra hardware in that drawer - spare shims for the blade guard, extra screws I've purchased over the years, extra few carriage bolts, etc. The upper drawer also stores my shop made ZCTPs, the wrenches, Rockler's fence attachment clamp things, the SMT fence when it's not in use, etc. The middle drawer has spares (I bought a busted BT3000 to get a lot of spare parts long ago) such as the blade holder clips, factory Ryobi T-nut plates, etc. Basically, a place for everything and everything in its place!

              I noticed BT3's came with several styles of leg stands. My BT3000 is one of the early 13amp models; the stand is a rectangular box with OPEN side panels... most of the rectangular box stands pictured on this site have end panels that are almost completely closed/blocked with only a "mail slot" opening at the bottom - part of the change to the 15amp motors? My internal box takes advantage of the large side openings in my stand, turning them into tall but shallow storage bays... great for Freud dado stack carriers for example. I added thin plywood doors too. As near as I can tell, BT3100s came only with the "splayed leg" stands - never the rectangular box stands. The splayed-leg stands would be much more difficult to adapt for storage; it'd be easier to simply replace them with a plywood box shelf/drawer cabinet. I thought about replacing the factory stand on mine with an all-new plywood cabinet in fact... re-using my existing 3 drawers. This would connect the saw base to the router cabinet hanging from the wide table kit and would replace the leg assembly on the wide table kit... would make the whole assembly much stiffer.

              Comment


              • #10
                You're right, the parts list for the BT3000 I have says nut #4 is a 5/8-18 nut.
                That is the arbor nut. Missing some clues.

                A standard ANSI 5/8" threaded nut is 15/16th wrench. and either 11 TPI (UNC) or 18 TPI (UNF).
                However the BT3000 arbor nut as supplied has a wrench size across the flats of 3/4" But, I don't think that makes any difference in operation.

                My tool holder here (magnetically attached) Spacers unused (when using dado) go on the L-hooks with the wrenches.
                If you copy this, I use all the stuff allt he time except the Allen wrenches. I have no recollection of ever using them since I built this 15+ years ago.
                If you want dedicated wrenches for your saw (1/2" for the riving knife mount and 3/4" for the arbor nut) you can pick individual wrenches at a pawn shop for around 2 bucks. instead of buying a whole set.
                Click image for larger version  Name:	image_9285.jpg Views:	0 Size:	45.9 KB ID:	842714
                Last edited by LCHIEN; 02-04-2021, 06:32 PM.
                Loring in Katy, TX USA
                If your only tool is a hammer, you tend to treat all problems as if they were nails.
                BT3 FAQ - https://www.sawdustzone.org/forum/di...sked-questions

                Comment


                • #11
                  I need to do that. Thanks for sharing!
                  Hank Lee

                  Experience is what you get when you don't get what you wanted!

                  Comment


                  • #12
                    The very first project I made when I bought my BT3000 was to make a tool storage box for the saw. In the following years, it has become storage of parts for all of my saws and routers. It was made from 3/4" plywood and all of the joins are miters. I made a 9"x6"x6" box and then sawed the lid from it. The hinge is a piece of piano hinge. The lock is a sash lock and the handle is an old drawer pull. Finish is Watco Danish oil and polyurethane varnish. Click image for larger version

Name:	D8A30AB7-3D9A-438C-85ED-1BF1793DDB32.jpeg
Views:	80
Size:	148.3 KB
ID:	842720 Click image for larger version

Name:	F261A568-9851-4FD6-80CE-A872E39BF6CF.jpeg
Views:	59
Size:	177.1 KB
ID:	842721
                    Jim Frye
                    The Nut in the Cellar.
                    ”Sawdust Is Man Glitter”

                    Comment


                    • #13
                      Loring, that's nIce!

                      I did something similar with my BT3100 when I first bought it years ago, but I like the fact that you have your wrench and a screw driver on board too. I think I could add that to the side storage box that I use.



                      Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_2029r.jpg Views:	0 Size:	104.1 KB ID:	842723

                      I also have similar 'holders' on my RAS and CMS.

                      Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_2021r.jpg Views:	0 Size:	176.5 KB ID:	842725 Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_2019r.jpg Views:	0 Size:	100.9 KB ID:	842724

                      I do have a mobile HF flat-drawer chest a few feet away, but it's better (IMO) to have certain tools right at hand on the machine.

                      CWS
                      Last edited by cwsmith; 02-04-2021, 09:02 PM.
                      Think it Through Before You Do!

                      Comment


                      • #14
                        Jim,

                        I like your tool chest. Problem with me is bench space and I'd probably forget where I'd stored the chest the last time I used it (I've been doing that a lot lately). That chest is pretty heavy duty though with the double-thickness of ply, piano hinge and great hardware.

                        CWS
                        Think it Through Before You Do!

                        Comment


                        • #15
                          On the subject of arbor nuts, I think manufacturers ought to do a lot better on providing specific information regarding material and thread specs. (Actually, I thought there would be some specific ASME standards for this kind of thing.)

                          Looking at my 1973 Craftsman RAS it appears to be a much heavier-duty arbor and nut, compared to the 2005 BT3100. The RAS arbor appears to be much more robust than the BT, and certainly the arbor nut is more substantial. I thought the BT arbor nut to be so light weight that I actually grabbed a magnet to see if it was steel or some type of alloy, it's actually that much lighter in weight than the RAS. Considering that they are both holding the same steel blade in position, I thought they might be more equal. But considering that the RAS is only rotating at 3450, compared to the 5,000 RPM of the BT, one might think the heavier nut would be on the BT. But of course, I'm not a mechanical engineer.

                          Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2024r.jpg
Views:	64
Size:	118.1 KB
ID:	842730 Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2023r.jpg
Views:	56
Size:	109.9 KB
ID:	842731 Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2025r.jpg
Views:	56
Size:	166.8 KB
ID:	842732


                          Pictures posted are BT3 arbor, RAS arbor, and comparison of arbor nuts and threading.

                          CWS
                          Think it Through Before You Do!

                          Comment


                          • LCHIEN
                            LCHIEN commented
                            Editing a comment
                            thanks for the pics. Not sure that the nut has to be really strong in this use. The arbor needs to be strong, to contain the spinning blade, and a well balanced spinning blade won't put much side load on the arbor except for the force of feeding the wood. The nut simply compresses the blade to the arbor to make it spin and its self-tightening.
                        Working...
                        X