Questions before I purchase new TS..

[cpritchard]

I have really enjoyed my BT3100, but it is time for something a little beefier and will hold its accuracy better. I am really at a crossroads though. I really like the Grizzly line of saws as well as the Ridgid TS3560.

Space is not a factor. 220V is already installed. I would like to spend less than 1000 but willing to spend above if necessary.

I used a friends JET supersawhttp://tinyurl.com/yddk9s and loved how quiet it was compared to the BT3100.

What would I gain by going to the G1023 cabinet saw or any cabinet saw for that matter, rather than going with a contractor saw such as the G0444Z or the Ridgid TS3650?

The TS3560 may be out if it does not acceppt aftermarket rails and fences.

Are the noise levels different on any of these saws.

Thanks for your help!

[cgallery]

I'd go for the Amazon Unisaw deal if it is still available.

[JSCOOK]

We have had a TS3650 in my father's shop now for last 6-7 years now and absolutely love it ...

[drumpriest]

Cabinet saws typically have heavier duty trunions, as well as everything else. 3hp motors as opposed to 1 1/2hp. Dust collection built in, though hybrids have that as well....

I was floored by the difference when I went to my current PM2000, but that's a bit of overkill. I would have been fine with a hybrid, but couldn't get one with a riving knife.

I would think one of the deciding factors should be the fence. The jet supersaw fence isn't the greatest. The delta hybrid has the T2 fence, which is a beismeyer knock-off, and pretty good. Dunno about the griz, the Ridgid fence seems pretty good, more BT like than Beismeyer like in design.

[eddy merckx]

FWW did a review of cabinet saws recently and gave the Griz the Best Value Award. I think it was the only one under a thousand bucks. http://www.amazon.com/Grizzly-G1023S...8&s=hi]grizzly[/link]. It gets really good feedback at Amazon.

One thing about getting a cabinet saw is you won't (probably) feel you need to upgrade again.

Eddy

[lcm1947]

Not too long ago and I mean weeks I too was wanting to upgrade and was pretty well decided on a contractors saw due to price and was leaning toward the Ridgid but the two things I didn't like and couldn't get past was the lack of a knife like we have on the 3100/3000 and the fact that all contractor saws have the motor hanging out the back creating sawdust everyplace. I just insist on a sawdust free workplace and just can't accept a machine that isn't as least as good as the 3100 in that regard. I have the Shark and what the saw doesn't keep up on the Shark does so it's a clean little saw. Yeah I know, wrong hobby to get into but...anyway that's my hang up. Anyway, from there you have two hybrid saws the DeWalt model DW746 and Jet JWSS-10PF. They both have the splitters too so there goes either of those. What a shame though as I really liked the DeWalt but of coure it also is the only one that has a stupid 2 1/2 " dust outlet. Now you're looking at cabinet saws and holy cow those are expensive. Especially for a part time weekend only kind of guy like me. Then if you look at these closely you notice that you probably or at least I would have had to purchase a separate better fence at least on the lower of the high priced monsters and add that expense onto an already high price - well that's when I made some modifications to my 3100 that was bugging me and have decided to keep it after all. I am now very happy and pleased with this little saw again. I would love to have a nice cabinet saw but for the life of me I just can't justify it. If you insist on a knife you'll just have to get the Powematic like drumpriest did or Sawstop. So anyway if you don't mind the dust or not having a knife then there are plenty of good saws out there and the Grizzly was rated Best Value in the 2007 Tool Guide so it may be just the ticket although the Ridgid would be very tempting. So good luck and above all else take your time and enjoy the experience. Heck that's half the fun.

[JTimmons]

I got an older version of the 1023 w/ the extended rails and love it. The dust collection is awesome below the table, you really don't need to hook up a DC to it, just cleaning it out with a shop vac would work great every now and then too.
I was pretty dead set on picking up an older Unisaw rust bucket and restoring it when I ran accross this one. Paid $600.00 for it and it came with a Uni-fence, not bad considering some of the prices I found for the fence and rail by itself were $350 to $400. (no more measuring cuts either, it's dead on everytime) So I basically got the saw for $200.
You might want to scope out sales in your area on craigslist and see if you can find something in your area.

[onedash]

craftsman club sale has the hybrid with beis fence on sale for $800. I love it......

[Popeye]

If I had had the money at the time, the PM2000 would have been my first choice. (Riving knife, Dust shroud on the blade, built in moble base) but it's over $2k.
That said, I bought the Griz 1023 with the long rails. I'll never look back. No doubt it's the best bang for the buck you can buy. I'll never buy another saw. Three inch white oak.... can't hear the motor change pitch. Accurate every time.
My only dig is the same as with everything cast iron... rust. Down here in South Georgia's constant high humidity it's a never ending battle. Pat

[JTimmons]

<snip> Three inch white oak.... can't hear the motor change pitch. Accurate every time.

I forgot to mention that, ripping white oak, like cutting through butter with a hot knife.

[Ken Massingale]

Chris,
All the saws suggested are fine machines, you probably won't go wrong with either. I have the TS3650 and love it. It does accept aftermarket rails and fences if that is a concern, but I see no need to go that route. The fence that comes on the saw is very good. I perhaps would consider going to an Incra system if I had the room.
Good luck with your decision.
ken

[Knottscott]

There's definitely some gains to be made with any of the full size saws, but I think you'll be farther ahead if you skip the contractor saw class altogether. The outboard motor causes some issues that the hybrids and cabinet saws don't suffer from, plus they take up unnecessary space. There are very few advantages of that design over a hybrid, and cabinet saw trumps them all.

What you'll gain with a contractor saw, hybrid, or cabinet saw is much a larger solid cast iron surface especially in front of the blade, quieter motor and possibly more perceived power (no contest with the 3hp cab saw), a rugged and accurate steel fence on most, cast iron and steel construction throughout, heavy mass and stability, and essentially a saw that should last for a lifetime with little maintenance. You'll get better DC with the hybrids and cabinet saws. The cabinet saw's trunnions are easy to align and will hold the settings extremely well. Some of the hybrids like the Craftsman and Steel City also feature cabinet mounted trunnions. All will accept standard accessories and jigs that are pretty much interchangeable. Even though there aren't any riving knives in this price range, there are options for low cost low profile splitters that will fit any of them. Though a less elegant solution, they will essentially perform the same function as a riving knife.

I'm extremely happy with my 22124, but the closer you get to $1K, the more closely you should look at taking the leap for the full cabinet saw. Since you've got 220v and are just about within budget range, cry once and make it the last saw you ever own. The cabinet saw is simply a more robust machine with more advantages. The downsides are cost and electrical requirements, and it looks like you can overcome both pretty easily.

Good luck.

[onedash]

A riving knife really only benefits you more than a splitter if you are doing dadoes or any non through cut right?

the only problem with my 22124 is sawdust coming out of the front of the guard. I have been using a zero clearance blade insert since I got it and I think that makes it a little worse.

[LarryG]

A riving knife really only benefits you more than a splitter if you are doing dadoes or any non through cut right?

Yes ... no ... it depends on how tall the splitter or riving knife are.

A riving knife is really just an improved splitter ... it goes up and down with the blade, and it hugs the blade more closely, which makes it more effective against kickbacks during the early part of a cut, or with short workpieces, than a splitter.

If you routinely use some kind of hold-down device (rollers, featherboard) on your rip fence, then I would say that a simple splitter is as effective as an RK in theory. Since I hunch most of us don't routinely use hold-downs, an RK is a bit safer in actual practice.

[lcm1947]

Hey LarryG you confused me there about a RK being more effective over a splitter at the beginning of a cut. Is that correct? I thought that kickbacks mostly occurred at the end of a cut and therefore the RK would be more effective at the end of a cut or am I misunderstanding this. Just trying to learn something. Certainly not disputing you.

Dustmight or onedash, could you tell me please who makes the 22124? I thought I pretty much knew them all but this one I don't know. Maybe an older model I'm not familiar with. Appreciate it.

A thought just occurred to me. Kreg makes a splitter I believe they call it which is a tiny little piece that you attach onto the throat plate just directly behind the blade. I think maybe if they really are any good and really work helping prevent kickback that that might be an answer to any of the saws that don't have a RK. I know they don't move up and down like a true RK but seems like they'd be better then a regular splitter that the big saws come with as far as kickback anyway.