My HF DC with a portable Thein Separator

[catta12]

My goal was to make a semi-portable Thien Separator for use with my 2-HP HF DC (ITEM 97869). The very first thing I did was put a Wynn 0.5 Micron filter on top. I never even put the stock bag on. I assume my lungs will be pleased.

The platform is a piece of Ύ” ply I had leftover from another project and I put (4) 4” locking casters on the corners and (2) 4” regular casters on the longer sides. This was probably overkill, but I would rather over do it once than have to fix it later. I bolted the metal poles of the DC to the platform at about a 15 degree bias toward the side where the motor would be. I then built a small stool for the motor to sit on. It is the same height as a 5 gallon bucket. I was originally going to secure the trash can to a frame, but found that it would sit just fine on the platform without further securing. I cheated by using a pre-made separator top (from Woodcraft on sale) to go on top of the trash can (from BORG). The guts of the separator were put together very much like on Phil Thien’s website: http://www.cgallery.com/jpthien/cy.htm

I plugged one side of the stock lid from the inside with a piece of clear acrylic and silicon I had laying around (makes a nice view of the swirling inside). I cut out the middle and installed an angled 4” dust port flange (from Amazon). The only other addition to the normal directions for a Thien baffle was that I put Ό” of silicon on the edge of the bottom layer of the baffle that comes in contact with the inside of the trashcan to create a better seal.

The metal ducting is all 5” except right before the separator where I had to reduce it to 4” to match the fitting (all from BORG). I may try to redo this section later to keep it 5”. Any suggestions from the DC experts? The joints of the ducting are sealed with duct sealant and an occasional duct screw. I found that the DC motor leaked air out BOTH of its seals, so I took them apart and sandwiched the stock seal with silicon and put it back together to dry.

A Dust-Right hose (Rockler) goes on the intake of the separator. I am going to put one of their swivel connectors there to keep from kinking the hose. The hand attachments for the Dust-Right slip over pieces of 2x4 that are mounted upright to the base platform. The Dust-Right hose seems to stay put pretty well as I have it in the first picture, but I might figure out a better way later.

Any suggestions for improvement are encouraged. What I am left with is about as portable (rolling around the garage) as I could come up with. I skipped a 5 gallon bucket because using my planer would fill it too quickly. I filled the trashcan up to the baffle today planning with no noticeable loss of suction. There was nothing more than a handful of dust in the DC bag.

[pelligrini]

That's pretty cool. What's the footprint? 36x48?

I picked up the swivel fitting last week, it works very well in my setup. It works exactly as advertized and there isn't much restriction. I hope it keeps swiveling in the future as easily as it does now.
http://www.bt3central.com/showthread...628#post416628
A more recent shot is below. It usually isn't inside the shop/shed during a session. It might give you an idea for the dustright hose storage. I bought their metal holder, but if I did it again I wouldn't waste the money.

So far I like being able to have two other hoses connected to the collector and having the dustright available for easy cleanup or to hookup another tool like my jointer or planer.

I'd like to see how you did the seperator lid. I've been thinking about setting up a seperator for planer & jointer use.I also have that same lid and I used to have a HD trashcan for it, but it imploded. http://www.bt3central.com/showthread.php?t=43345

[Bill in Buena Park]

Alan,
Looks like a solid setup.

For reducing footprint - have you considered:
1) Rotate the filter/bag collector unit intake port toward the long axis of the platform
2) Move the can directly in front of the collector intake port
3) Rework the shelf so that it suspends the motor/impeller unit directly over the chip separator so that -

a) the impeller has a straight-line exhaust into the collector unit and

b) the impeller intake has a straight line pulling from the chip separator

In this scenario, I'd consider a straight duct between the impeller exhaust and the collector unit, and I'd say a straight run of flex hose down from the impeller intake to separator lid which would eliminate some of the ducting bends and still allow for easy removal of the lid from the can.

[catta12]

What's the footprint? 36x48?


I'd like to see how you did the seperator lid. I've been thinking about setting up a seperator for planer & jointer use.I also have that same lid and I used to have a HD trashcan for it, but it imploded. http://www.bt3central.com/showthread.php?t=43345

The footprint is 30x36. I can take more pictures of the separator if that would help you out.

[dbhost]

An interesting setup, but that plumbing looks like a HUGE restriction.

Rockler a few months ago sent out a free woodworking plan to take a standard type DC like ours, spin the outlet from the impeller and put it straight into the inlet ring, so you only have a short, maybe 4" or so jumper of the 5" flex hose connecting the two... and the intake of the impeller points straight down. A 30 gallon trash can with Thien Cyclone separator or similar fits directly beneath the impeller intake, again with a short, STRAIGHT run of flex line.

[catta12]

For reducing footprint - have you considered:
1) Rotate the filter/bag collector unit intake port toward the long axis of the platform
2) Move the can directly in front of the collector intake port
3) Rework the shelf so that it suspends the motor/impeller unit directly over the chip separator so that -

a) the impeller has a straight-line exhaust into the collector unit and

b) the impeller intake has a straight line pulling from the chip separator

In this scenario, I'd consider a straight duct between the impeller exhaust and the collector unit, and I'd say a straight run of flex hose down from the impeller intake to separator lid which would eliminate some of the ducting bends and still allow for easy removal of the lid from the can.

Funny you should ask, that was pretty much my original plan. I eventually changed the plan because 1) I was not sure that flipping the cheap HF motor on its side wouldn't cause it an early death 2) the motor mounts are not very beefy and serve better under the motor rather than from the side

I am sure the configuration you laid out would work well, I just didn't want to find new motor mounts and was not sure about making the bearings wear out quickly by rolling the motor. Was my concern for naught?

[dbhost]

Funny you should ask, that was pretty much my original plan. I eventually changed the plan because 1) I was not sure that flipping the cheap HF motor on its side wouldn't cause it an early death 2) the motor mounts are not very beefy and serve better under the motor rather than from the side

I am sure the configuration you laid out would work well, I just didn't want to find new motor mounts and was not sure about making the bearings wear out quickly by rolling the motor. Was my concern for naught?

There are a few guys on Sawmill Creek that have spun their impellers sideways for various reasons.... Several years of hard use down the road and there are no known bearing issues...

FWIW, the HF DC is not known for bearing failure. It IS known for the start / run capacitor and / or switch failure... But then again, so are most DCs...

The Rockler plan gives you guidelines on building your new mounts. Yeah the HF mounts are kind of flimsy...

[catta12]

I guess I missed that Rockler plan. I got the one for a mobile DC base, but it was for a Jet that already has the impeller attached directly to the inlet collar. It was mostly focused on storing the Dust-Right attachments.

If the bearings will hold up with a rotated motor, I might reconfigure my DC monster again later. Just from my experience, I would say that suction isn't much different now with the plumbing as with the Dust-Right hose connected right to the intake of the impeller in the standard setup. I tried to keep the bends as slow and gentle as I could. I am sure that completely eliminating the plumbing would help though.

[LCHIEN]

Funny you should ask, that was pretty much my original plan. I eventually changed the plan because 1) I was not sure that flipping the cheap HF motor on its side wouldn't cause it an early death 2) the motor mounts are not very beefy and serve better under the motor rather than from the side

I am sure the configuration you laid out would work well, I just didn't want to find new motor mounts and was not sure about making the bearings wear out quickly by rolling the motor. Was my concern for naught?

You could just rotate the motor/impellor assembly about the motor axis 90 degrees. That keeps the shaft horizontal but points the exit port to the side rather than up and eliminates one sharp bend in the ducting.

Rotating the dustbag/filter tower clockwise (from the top) about its axis to bring the inlet port more towards the motor would eliminate much of the other bend.

I have heard these bends in the impellor to bag stack dust ring is a significant source of CFM loss. You have two bends vs. a straight shot being ideal.

[pelligrini]

The footprint is 30x36. I can take more pictures of the separator if that would help you out.

Yea, I would appreciate it if you don't mind. Thanks.

[LinuxRandal]

I would also like more pictures of the seperator, outside of the can please!

[JR]

I can't help with your excellent Thien baffle and plumbing work. I do have a tip, though.

I kept the old 30 micron bottom bag on the DC, and use it as a cover for the plastic bag. If you're going mobile you just might run into something. The extra protection might prevent a palm-to-forehead moment.

JR

[catta12]

Pictures of the separator guts. Offset gap between the can and baffle is 1 1/4". Dowels are 3/4 x 6" with a pilot hole drilled through dowels, lid and baffle and attached with screws. The holes in the lid were also sealed with silicone. I was considering trimming off some of the extra plastic under the lid, but it works fine as is, so I will probably leave it. The elbow needed a little sanding where it meets the baffle to make it sit better. The portion of the baffle that comes in contact with the side of the can also has silicone on it to make a tight seal. The extra hole in the lid is sealed with a piece of acrylic and silicone. The lid comes with an indentation in the center, I just cut it out with a dremel equipped with a cut off disc. The angled flange bolted over the cut out hole and was bolted and siliconed in place.