How do I convert a single rail kitchen drawer into a two side rail drawer?

[FuryRoad]

I have old kitchen drawers from the 70's, and they have a single "rail" down the middle underneath. The wheel assembly on the back of the drawer slides into it.

I would like to change it to the kind that slide, the nicer kind on the sides, not ones with a wheel.

The problem is there is nothing to mount the drawer rails, the side kind, to. There's only a hole in the cabinet, drawer on the middle rail. Only thing I know to do is somehow build sides inside the cabinet so the newer side drawer sliding rails can screw onto it.

Does that make any sense? Build new drawers?

It looks like this,

http://www.rockler.com/single-track-slide

They're just not that durable or steady or sturdy. The fall out and tear up the front of the cabinet, eventually stop sliding, bad. I have replaced them before. Ends up falling again.

EDIT: Something like this is what I want it to be,

http://www.rockler.com/accuride-full-extension-zinc-box-drawer-slides-series-3832-zinc-full-extension-slides

[capncarl]

The problem you have (or probably have) is the existing slides require 1/8" clearance on each side of your drawer and the new style slides require 1/2" clearance on each side of your drawer. I.E. If your drawer is 12" wide the drawer opening will be 12 1/4" vrs 13" to accommodate the new slides. To make the new style slides work you will have to make a smaller drawer or a larger drawer opening.
Sorry to burst your bubble.
capncarl

[twistsol]

I've used the slides you want on a few projects and they are really good slides. What you are probably going to have an issue with is that the center mount slides typically are used on drawers with very little side clearance. There are a couple of issues with changing the type of slides.

1. I double checked the spec sheet rather than going from memory. The slides you want need 1/2" clearance on each side of the drawer to the cabinet opening, you probably have less.
2. The second requirement for them is that the interior cabinet sides need to be flush with the cabinet opening. I'd guess that 70's cabinets have a face frame and that the interior sides of the cabinet are not flush with the drawer sides.

Issue number 2 is easy enough to solve by putting a spacer inside the cabinet to mount the slides to. Issue number 1 though would require rebuilding the drawers unless you get lucky and the drawers are exactly 1" narrower than the drawer opening.

There are much better concealed under mount slides such as the ones linked below but they are nearly twice the cost of the ones you want and they either require the inside of the cabinet to be flush with the opening or a bracket at to connected it to the back of the cabinet:

http://www.rockler.com/blum-tandem-full-extension-drawer-slides-with-blumotion-slides

Finally check out the link below on selecting drawer slides. It has a fair amount of information

Choosing the Right Drawer Slide

[Stytooner]

When we made custom cabinets, we used to build frames for the slides. Three sides. Maybe 1.5" x 3/4". They would extend from just behind the face frame to the back of the cabinet structure. Then we would mount the slides to that.
The slides overhang the frames to mount just inside the face frame opening. So the frame just butts the back of the face frame and the slides get screwed into the face frame. Then we slide the drawer in. Clamp the front so it is flush to the face frame. Then install a couple screws in the middle of the slide frame on the back of the cabinet. This method allows easy upgrade of slide rail systems too, but you do need the clearance.


On a side note, you can get better quality single rail drawer mounts that would use the existing openings.

http://www.woodworkerexpress.com/Center-Bottom-Mount-35-lb.-Ball-Bearing-Slides-Ball-Bearing-Slide-Rear-Mounting-Brackets-18-Zinc.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cse&utm_campaign=google_product_ads&source=googlebase&gclid=CIOGhsun1MwCFRNahgodpWYElA

[poolhound]

As Carl says you may not have the side clearance. Basically the drawer carcass will need to be 1" less than the face frame hole width. You could alwasy make new drawers as you say but that seems like a lot of work for waht must be already functioning drawers.

Maybe an easier option is to replace this single cheap under mount slide with a quality one like this http://woodworker.com/14-34-center-m...su-936-911.asp

You can also get them in pairs which add extra stability and weight capacity although it can get pricey http://www.rockler.com/accuride-ecli...ermount-slides

[radhak]

Photos would be helpful - of the drawer from below, and of the drawer opening in the cabinet.

As others have said, changing the type of drawer rails involves changing the size of drawer (or the openings), not an easy task, and you might end up with a worse situation than now.

Your better bet is to replace the old bottom rail with new ones - like the ones Jon has linked above; you might be astounded how well these function, and how easy they are to replace.
(Depending on the existing opening, you may or may not be able to use the dual-rail on the bottom. The photographs could tell us better).

[FuryRoad]

Thanks everyone. Here are images.

http://postimg.org/gallery/2qw0yniiy/

A few here. Hideous.

[capncarl]

It looks like someone has already tried to install different slides. You may be able to fit the 1/2" slides in some of the "enlarged" openings. To answer you question of how to install something to attach the new slides to.... I would cut a 1x4 that would just barely fit beside the drawer in the cabinet and attach it to the back of the cabinet and the face frame using a Kregg pocket hole jig. You could test the fit of the new slide by cutting a piece of wood the same size as the new slide and using it as a mock up.

[tfischer]

If you have enough clearance, you can mount slides to the face frame, and to a bracket screwed into the back of the cabinet (they will sell these brackets along side of the slides when you buy them).

I don't think you have enough clearance for a traditional side slide, but maybe the ball-bearing ones could be squeezed in.

[capncarl]

Viewing the photos showing the damage to the face frames you may be able to build new face frames with wide enough openings to accomidate your existing drawers with new style side slides.

[FuryRoad]

Viewing the photos showing the damage to the face frames you may be able to build new face frames with wide enough openings to accomidate your existing drawers with new style side slides.

Is it possible to build a new face frame without building a whole new cabinet/box?

[poolhound]

Is it possible to build a new face frame without building a whole new cabinet/box?

at least in theory you wouldnt need to although removing the old face frame may well wreck the cabinet. Can you post a picture of the whole unit?

[Stytooner]

Reskinning the face frames might be a much easier task. Maybe use some 1/2" stock. It will push your doors and drawer fronts out further, but for asthetics, cost, and less cussing, it will be the easiest way to accomplish what you want. Cut your clearances in the old face frame first, then just cover with new material. It will look pretty good and work even better for very little cash.

[capncarl]

Your real problem may be...... Will the boss let you take her kitchen apart for that long?
Cabinets are usually just plywood boxes with a face frame nailed onto the box. When removing the face frame, Nothing is really as easy as it seems, you could run into situation where someone added extra nails through the countertop before they added Formica top. Or they could have glued the face frame on. With some good planning you could build new face frames with drawer slides attached and do a swap over in a full day or so. In the big scheme of things you may be better off building or buying new cabinets and putting these old cabinets in your shop.
capncarl

[FuryRoad]

Your real problem may be...... Will the boss let you take her kitchen apart for that long?
Cabinets are usually just plywood boxes with a face frame nailed onto the box. When removing the face frame, Nothing is really as easy as it seems, you could run into situation where someone added extra nails through the countertop before they added Formica top. Or they could have glued the face frame on. With some good planning you could build new face frames with drawer slides attached and do a swap over in a full day or so. In the big scheme of things you may be better off building or buying new cabinets and putting these old cabinets in your shop.
capncarl

I am prepared for that contingency. I have a bathroom with the same counters. I'm going to destroy those first for practice. I have been warned, however.