Is PEX just a way to give plumbers continuous employment?

[cwsmith]

Perhaps, but I'm guessing this house was and still is a costly proposition for all involved. After the fellow bought it, he put another 60 to 80K into it, from what the contractors told me. Then it sat for two years before he was able to find a rentor. The guy that's in it now is a nice enough fellow on a one-on-one basis, but he is far from a responsible adult. I've had to go out there three four times in the last year to tell him to curb his 1:30 AM basket ball in the driveway and his 2:00 AM plus loud partying. Smoker running here in the city with neighbors calling me to complain and on three occasions the cops showing up and once the fire dept. the neighbor who owns the apartment across the street has had two of his elderly renter's leave because of the noise and the smoke from this place.

The guy says he's moving out this winter and I'm sure we'll all be greatful... but what's next!

CWS

[woodturner]

Perhaps, but I'm guessing this house was and still is a costly proposition for all involved. After the fellow bought it, he put another 60 to 80K into it, from what the contractors told me. Then it sat for two years before he was able to find a rentor.

Hmm, that doesn't sound so good. Is the housing market not "hot" in your area? The media would have us believe the market is hot everywhere ;-)

Someone bought a foreclosure around here, paid $50K, probably put another $80K or so into it, sold it pretty quickly for $250K. Was a decent deal for everyone, except probably the original owner who was foreclosed.

The guy says he's moving out this winter and I'm sure we'll all be greatful... but what's next!

Based on internet comments and posts, it seems that neighbor issues are a common theme. Sad but true.

[cwsmith]

Unfortunately the whole economy of Binghamton is terrible. While once a very thriving area, it is now about as low as it can be. Just in the last summer we've lost Macy's and Sears and the Oakdale Mall that they anchored both ends of is more than 60% empty.

I grew up here in the 50's and 60's and when I got out of high school in 1962 anybody could find a fairly decent job if they wanted one. My first summer job was a Fowler, Dick and Walker, a large and stylish department store, with four floors of high quality goods and services. There were at least another twenty stores in the area that rivaled it, More than 20 theaters, 50-plus restaurants, and more grocery stores, car dealerships, and factories than I can begin to remember.

The big factories were IBM, Link Aviation, GE, Ansco, Ozalid, Endicott-Johnson, Titchner, Stowe, Kroehler, Vail-Ballou, and Universal Instruments.... except for the latter, every single one of them are now gone leaving behind only deteriorating abandoned buildings. Smaller manufacturing like Kupfrian, where I worked in 1974, had four plants, Seary had two, Klien two, and several others with one or two facilities. We even had a vast brick yard, and three different quarries in the area. Dairy farming was in abundance, as well as a couple of logging companies. Several different lumber retailers too, with only one still surviving today.

With all the factories, there were supporting companies too. I spent eight years at Vestal Modern Design, with competitors like Valley, Midstate Litho, Gar-Tek, Orion, and a couple of others... all now gone! Little machine shops were everywhere, employing anywhere from a couple of dozen to a couple of hundred... those are gone too.

Like I said, if a person wanted a job back then it was not hard to find.

So, to show how real estate is in most neighborhoods, I just sold a house over on the east side. It was my late in-laws. They bought it in 1943 just a few weeks before they married. It was about 1600 sq feet with separate garage and a recently paved driveway. A very well maintained three bedroom, a den, formal living room and dining room, modernized eat-in kitchen with all new appliances, a kitchen in the basement with an additional dishwasher, refrigerator and stand-up freezer, a small workshop, separate laundry room with new washer and dryer and a nice-sized rec room with a small bar which we used to have our holiday and other family celebrations in. Plumbing and electricity up to code, gas-fired baseboard heat top to bottom. Well insulated and storage space everywhere. In addition it had a fenced in back yard with fruit trees and a nice covered patio. Marketed for only $75 K and after nine months sold for $65K.... we only had two interested parties.

Yes, the area is depressed. Just goes to show what "trickle down" economics did for our area! Elmira and Corning, NY are pretty much the same. The lower end of the middle class can't afford and those that can want 3,000 feet or better in an upscale neighbor where houses were built in the last 20 years.

CWS

[capncarl]

I don’t think that PEX was invented to give plumbers continuous employment. It just worked out that way! Everything seems to be headed toward a throwaway society, and the very homes we live in seem to have veered down that path. All of the building trades want products that they can throw in place with the minimum labor and thought on their part. I’ve observed plumbing companies working under one master plumber liscense and sending inexperienced plumbers to the job with a couple of helpers to install residential plumbing systems. All things considered, they do remarkably well, but nothing compared to the way plumbing was installed in houses 50years ago. Sad.
capncarl

[Slik Geek]

(Yes, I know that this thread has gone a bit off the original post's topic, I just had to followup on the posts by Woodturner and Capncarl... I thought both had valid points).

I was house hunting a couple years ago and looked at some foreclosed homes. Here is what I observed here in northern Illinois:

• Some houses clearly had somebody to periodically check on homes in their care during the foreclosure process. Even so, those houses were allowed to deteriorate. What banks do in this area is have the plumbing serviced so that freezing (hopefully) won't cause damage. They drain water pipes and put antifreeze in sink and toilet traps. With that completed, they "save" money by cranking way back on the heat. It seemed like most of the foreclosed houses that I saw had moderate to severe mildew. One house that I considered had beautiful wood cabinets that had severe mildew damage.
• Another house had a finished basement that absolutely needed the sump pump in operation in order to preserve the basement. If one took a moderately careful look at the house, it was obvious that the house needed to pump lots of water out of the basement sump pump. The septic field was uphill from the house, requiring a lift station! When it rained (or if you ran water), ground water would flow towards the basement. An elaborate drainage setup had been created to handle all the water flowing from the basement sump pump. The sump pump failed during rain one day and the basement flooded. The bank had to hire contractors to tear out the basement walls and carpeting. A little proactive spending on protecting the house would have saved a whole lot of money for the bank. (The owner had slowed the foreclosure process to the maximum extent possible, in part by filing for bankruptcy. It took 2-1/4 years to get the foreclosure judgment, and then six months before they could sell the house).

[capncarl]

How the banks handle forclosure house maintenance is probably a regional thing. In this warmer climate I’ve never heard of anyone draining the water out of the piping and adding antifreeze to the p traps ( I did it to my houseboat, but that’s just me ). They probably didn’t want the added cost of running the ac/heater, knowing that they would have to maintain a comfortable temp to offset the mildew, so they just pulled the plug.

It’s probably a good thing that you passed on the second house that you mentioned with the basement sump pump! It sounded like a terrible engineered wastewater disposal system that would yield its owners endless agony. The forclosure was probably a good thing for the previous owners, whether they realized it or not, it went ahead and put them out of their misery! I wouldn’t wish a house with water problems on my worst enemy, and this one sounded like it had enough water problems for several enemies.

capncarl