The times that try men's souls

**crokett** · 03-31-2009, 06:20 PM

I've done some teaching myself, both to beginners and more advanced folk. My advice is don't short change the other students at the expense of the one. You can give him some remedial help but he is an adult who is paying good money, so if he wants to waste it, that is his problem.

**jackellis** · 03-31-2009, 06:34 PM

I knew a few folks like the golfer in college. One guy in particular spent all his time on photography and women. After two years of screwing off, his parent's told him he'd have to pay for a degree on his own.

**LCHIEN** · 03-31-2009, 06:53 PM

what ever happened to the word FLUNK?
can you not flunk a guy even if he paid for the course?

**Uncle Cracker** · 03-31-2009, 06:59 PM

Some people just don't get it, and it's usually because they don't want it bad enough...

**gsmittle** · 03-31-2009, 07:01 PM

Originally posted by jcjrsmith

I work full time for a very large utility (the largest water company in the country) in their IT department. I have also been a Microsoft Certified Trainer for the last 12 years. I got out of full time training a few years ago, and now teach Microsoft Certification classes for the local community college part time. Typically Tuesdays and Thursdays, 6-9:30 pm, and the occasional Saturday, 8-4. They pay very good part time money, which allows me to buy more toy...er tools. Yeah, that's it, tools.

I am in class right now - my students are doing a lab. All of my students are career-changers, with very litte background in IT. Four seem to pick this stuff up and understand it VERY quickly. The other guy is...well....not gettin' it.

Last week we started our lessons on DNS. I stress to my students that in order to have a successful Active Directory, they MUST know DNS back and forth. I told them at the beginning that this was some of the most important material we would cover. Guess who decided that last week would be a good time to go to the Carolinas to go golfing?

He's back now, and is completely lost. And he admitted to me that he did not take the time to study the material on his own for the classes he missed. Oy, this student is killin' me.....

Wish me luck.

Jerry,

Welcome to teaching! I deal with this stuff every day, except it's teenagers in a public school, so the education's "free." 90% at least make an effort, the other 20% (when they show up) do their best to disrupt the others.

Yes, I know the percentages are off. Musta skipped that day...

g.

**Tom Slick** · 03-31-2009, 08:52 PM

My WiFe teaches High School and Jr. College lower level math and algebra, you can guess the spread of students she gets. everything from "junior needs to pass this class to get into Harvard" to "I missed the last 4 weeks 'cause my friend's car broke down and it was my only ride".

**WLee** · 03-31-2009, 09:20 PM

Based on my experience he'll probably be quickly promoted to be an IT manager and then shortly thereafter he'll be a CIO (his golfing and BS skills will see to that).

And I *wish* that I were joking, I truly do.

I worked one contract where the IT manager (in the position for 3 years, all kinds of certs hanging on his cubical wall) -- anyway one evening he came up to me and, apropos of nothing, says: "What is this 'compile' thing I always here you guys talking about? Is that like some kind of menu command you select? And what exactly does it do?"

Or another great one was the co-worker (with a recent full 4 year Bachelor's degree in CS) who came to me desperate to get his little javascript web-page project (needed to finish his "masters" degree) fixed, and -- after picking his brain for about 10 minutes -- I realize he has absolutely NO CLUE about the Document Object Model... zero, zilch, nada... he'd pretty much just gotten away with faking it (apparently by copying & hacking examples out of books or off the web) for years, and either got lucky in that his hacks inadvertently worked, or none one bothered to ever check his work.

I've come to the firm conclusion that somewhere near 90% of the people out there are functionally incompetent (they can be competent at hitting the "Next" button on software installs, but that's about the limit).

**LinuxRandal** · 03-31-2009, 09:41 PM

Originally posted by Tom Slick

My (PLEASE CORRECT) teaches High School and Jr. College lower level math and algebra, you can guess the spread of students she gets. everything from "junior needs to pass this class to get into Harvard" to "I missed the last 4 weeks 'cause my friend's car broke down and it was my only ride".

Freudian slip? Don't let your .... read this until you fix it.

Now, I have been wanting to take a Linux training/certification class for some time. Heck, for fun, I am reading Ethereal, Nmap, and the three books in the TCP/IP Illustrated series. I've grown up around pc's (playing with punch cards, first IBM PC's, Lugables, etc), and was expected to do so much more. That was part of the reason I kinda went away from them. (it's supposed to be fun)
I still on occassion, get offered or asked, why I don't do x. A few years back, I thought I had a job, but the final deciding factor, was the political person in charge, chose his friend.
Every year, I get info and signup sheets for Usenix, but until my house is paid off, I can't go. I know what is important, there are times for fun, but for the most part, you have to keep your nose to the grindstone, no one is going to do it for you.

**RodKirby** · 03-31-2009, 10:30 PM

When I got my Learner's permit for my Vespa, I received a letter stating - in 24 size font and underlined:

READ the Motorcycle manual from VicRoads (our DMV). There was a 40 question paper we had to pass.

If you don't have a passport photo you will forfeit the fee (A$180)

I was in a class of 10 and, you guessed it - 5 hadn't read the manual - and failed!

6 didn't have a photo - and they were also told to leave.

They ALL complained bitterly - WTF!

**LCHIEN** · 03-31-2009, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by RodKirby

When I got my Learner's permit for my Vespa, I received a letter stating - in 24 size font and underlined:

READ the Motorcycle manual from VicRoads (our DMV). There was a 40 question paper we had to pass.

If you don't have a passport photo you will forfeit the fee (A$180)

I was in a class of 10 and, you guessed it - 5 hadn't read the manual - and failed!

6 didn't have a photo - and they were also told to leave.

They ALL complained bitterly - WTF!

Seems like in your class of 10 people, 11 people washed out. How did that leave you, Rod???? were you the 12th?

(Why do I always check the math?)

**jcjrsmith** · 04-01-2009, 04:13 AM

Well, it was a long night but we got thru it. This is a class to prepare students to get their Microsoft Certification. There are no pass/fail or letter grades given out - at the end of the class, the students will have to schedule themselves for a series of certification exams at a Prometric testing center ($125 per test, and they will have to take three exams). So, they pass or fail themselves.

When teaching career-changers, I have a different mind-set going in to each class than when I am teaching folks who already work in the IT world. Career-changers need a lot more hand-holding (for lack of a better term) because for most of them, this is the first time they have looked at any operating system beyond what they run on their computer at home.
When I left the military in '95, I spent a year teaching career-changers full-time. It was a tough year. The most common comment on my end-of-course evaluations by the students was "He has the patience of a saint".

My career since then has gone from full-time trainer, to training and consulting, to full-time IT/part-time trainer. The reason I renew my Microsoft Certified Trainer credential every year is I love to teach, and it never hurts to have something to fall back on if the full-time IT gig experiences a downturn.

Of the five students I have, three were unemployed when the classes started, and the other two were working in positions they hope to change. One has since found a position managing a service desk for a state agency, but I think that is just a stop-gap for him. They started out a highly motivated, but I don't think this one student realized the sheer amount of information they would have to absorb. It truly is a "drinking from the firehose" experience and I don't think he was prepared for that.

**jabe** · 04-01-2009, 04:36 AM

I taught wood shop & building & construction at a public high school for 25+ yrs. I feel your pain. I would help if they ask for it and came on their own time, in your case, U should charge him for tutoring. If he don't meet U half way just flunk him.

**sparkeyjames** · 04-01-2009, 05:25 AM

These are grown adults who have no critical thinking skills. When they fail those tests they are going to blame YOU.

**RodKirby** · 04-01-2009, 11:24 AM

Originally posted by LCHIEN

Seems like in your class of 10 people, 11 people washed out. How did that leave you, Rod???? were you the 12th?

(Why do I always check the math?)

I should have said - one guy didn't read the manual AND didn't have a photo...

The times that try men's souls

The times that try men's souls

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