Banned from Amazon.com?!

[jackellis]

What they have decided is that its cheaper to get rid of even good $$ volume customers and to cut 90% of their CS costs. Probably those transactions, with returns or credits (even if legit) and the CS costs associated (e.g. a 15 minute call with a CS rep can cost them $20 in just labor and burden) eat up all the profit from the sales.

Jeff Bezos (Amazon's CEO) is a smart guy, but I sometimes think he may be too smart for his own good. If complicated tie-ins are the problem, Amazon should get rid of them. Even if a customer costs more, the cost of returns and handholding ought to be compared with the customer's profitability.

[cgallery]

I wonder if Amazon could have accidentally screwed-up the code for a bot that handles these cancellations. There seems to be an avalanche of complaints just in the last few days.

[davidtu]

Loring you may be right, but it is still bogus for a company to penalize someone because they availed themselves of services. I am certainly going to have a talk with them. FYI, almost all of my interactions were via the very efficient and inexpensive email support variety; I am fairly confident that they are going to lose money losing me as a customer.

If they have a 30 day price guarantee, then they have no business closing my account because I take advantage of it. If they advertise a discount to be applied at checkout and it is not applied, then I have the right to challenge the amount paid and be refunded. If in refunding the amount due they forget to pay me back the WA state sales tax collected, it is my duty to point it out.

I did not have many returns--except for one large item which I went out of my way to try to get them to halt before it left their warehouse and which they told me to refuse the shipment of, I can only think of two items: a broken clamp and a book printed in Arabic.

No this is Amazon's own policies and any honorable business should not punish the customer because they took advantage of it or because they were informed or careful. Most cases Amazon was making errors and I am not inclined to overlook errors that cost me money.

Right now, I am disgusted with them. I feel really used in that I have spent so much money with them and they treat me like sh*t. They ban shoplifters from stores--I am not a shoplifter but they make me feel like one, and of course I have no easy voice to protest.

However, if there are others out there like me, Amazon might just hear us and regret the inevitable bad press that they will get from it.

Two other tidbits: I have an Amazon credit card through which I make all of my online purchases; cutting me off Amazon will result in cancellation of that card and will cost them money. That card earns me $25 gift certificates per $xxx purchased of which I still carried a positive balance at Amazon.com. No mention of them refunding this amount to me, however.

[Uncle Cracker]

It sounds as though Amazon is gambling the farm that one of the major draws that has made them a successful enterprise (customer service) is no longer needed, nor are the customers who have utilized it. I do think that people who habitually show a pattern of returning the bulk of what they buy, or who blatantly defraud Amazon in some way, should be weeded out, but I think there should be some latitude there, in order that people who aren't really a liability don't get trapped on the wrong side of the line. Amazon is often themselves responsible for product returns (it's happened to me), and they shouldn't ban people who have returned merchandise under these circumstances, but it seems (based on what I have been reading elsewhere these last couple of days) that many people do fit into this category. Pity...

[Alex Franke]

However, if there are others out there like me, Amazon might just hear us and regret the inevitable bad press that they will get from it.

I agree. Even if they identify an account with a large number of "incidents," it seems the customer should at least get a warning with a description of why the red flag went up, and an opportunity to make it good... not just get their heads lopped off.

I've been a supported of Amazon since they opened their virtual doors, but hearing of cruel and harsh treatment like this is really making me think twice.

Maybe its time to find a new place to shop online...

[leehljp]

Sprint, I believe it was, just a year ago let a whole bunch of people out of their "contracts" because they were "severe complainers" by Sprint's account. (Sometimes it pays to complain.)

I can see this as a trend too, to cut losses with CS that IMO are part of business. While having to put up with complaints has always been a problem, but the idea of company good will was seen and held in the light of "community mindedness". But now it is the bottom dollar.

When a company becomes large enough that it can cut loose a whole group that they deem "time consumers, i.e. complainers", then it does not have to listen to their customer base. Regardless of the success that Vista enjoys among people on this forum and other forums that I frequent, Microsoft's days of telling its customers what they MS want them (customers) to hear and follow are sorely being put to test.

Some companies become big enough to disregard complaints on some issues and dismiss them but it doesn't take long for the customer community to bite back. I will be in the market for a 50+ inch LCD TV when I return home in two years and have been looking at Amazon's. This will cause me to look at other places. I don't want a company to tell me my complaint isn't legitimate when it doesn't work. Same for clothes that I order that don't fit (which I usually don't order online except for LE or LLB.)


I would not doubt that I get one for my two or three orders a year that I have shipped to my USA address.

1. My PO Box is my Legal US address; 2. The USPS will not deliver to my house in my small home town (and in many small towns.)
3. Amazon will not allow for P.O. Box addresses even for those shipped via USPS. 4. USPS will not put a notice in my PO Box if the sender does not have the BOX number on it.

I always complain about this online!

And for that reason, I always insist on FedEx, UPS or street delivery service and pay for it but they occasionally choose to send via USPS anyway and it never makes it to me.

I complain!

I don't like their "Vendor Sending" as that becomes part of the headache too.

[davidtu]

Amazon's customer service was second to none and for me I had no qualms about ordering from them time and time again. I had full confidence that I'd get a good price and it was guaranteed and if there was an issue they'd take it back no problems (though as I've said I didn't return almost anything). Most times I would simply go direct to Amazon to make my purchase and the times I didn't, I used their credit card anyway so they got a piece that way too.

All the brand loyalty they earned from me may be squandered here and if it cannot be reconiled I sure hope the rest of you think twice about Amazon. You know it reminds me of that parable that goes something like "When they came for my neighbor, I stood silent; when they finally came for me there was no one to speak out". (Not to trivialize the actual reference, but the gist of it applies.)

As I posted over on SlickDeals, I believe that those of us who agressively follow what Amazon does and ask it to honor all its pricing policies do everyone a favor in that it holds the business to honor its word and its policies; too many wouldn't bother. Now the squeaky wheel gets the axe!

Ah... I guess I should wait until I talk to them tomorrow and see what's what. I may have to organize a sit-in over at Jeff Bezo's place. Any takers?

[cgallery]

If they have a 30 day price guarantee, then they have no business closing my account because I take advantage of it.

I'll go one further: Seeing as they recently reversed their price guarantee for everyone, the thought of jettisoning customers that have used it in the past seems to make no sense at all!

[dkerfoot]

It is unfortunate, but at the end of the day, they own the business and can choose who they want to sell to.

Customer Service costs money and apparently you are such a successful bargain hunter, they were losing money selling to you. Take it as a badge of pride - like gamblers who are banned from casinos!

When I was doing IT, I fired a couple of customers who I simply couldn't afford. These moves strike me as pretty ham-fisted though and I sympathize with your frustration. I was recently banned from eBay for 30 days, after being a customer for 8 years and a Silver Power Seller for over 3 years. My crime? I tried selling discount certificates. Turns out it was against policy, which is fine but the reason they banned me was because they accused me of selling them for the sole purpose of letting users "Buy" positive feedback. Utter nonsense, but there is no arguing with eBay...

If you do wish to continue buying from Amazon, you could probably get a credit card that uses your work address for the billing address. Even better, use the LOYL's name and business address (unless you don't want her to know your Amazon buying habits!)

[LCHIEN]

Loring you may be right, but it is still bogus for a company to penalize someone because they availed themselves of services. I am certainly going to have a talk with them. FYI, almost all of my interactions were via the very efficient and inexpensive email support variety; I am fairly confident that they are going to lose money losing me as a customer.

If they have a 30 day price guarantee, then they have no business closing my account because I take advantage of it. If they advertise a discount to be applied at checkout and it is not applied, then I have the right to challenge the amount paid and be refunded. If in refunding the amount due they forget to pay me back the WA state sales tax collected, it is my duty to point it out.

I did not have many returns--except for one large item which I went out of my way to try to get them to halt before it left their warehouse and which they told me to refuse the shipment of, I can only think of two items: a broken clamp and a book printed in Arabic.

....

I agree with you on all points.
What may have happened, and we don't as a group know the formula they used to do this "exclusion" may be the way they implemented it

Maybe the formula was strictly Number of incidents without regard to total transactions

Maybe the formula weighted returns and calls equally

LIke many businesses, the promise of certain guarantees is what tips the customers to them, but in practice the store rarely has to make good on them or make it just a bit too much trouble. For instance, price guarantees, many customers, once having bought the product don't continue to peruse the ads for another 30 days.. they just use the product an are unaware of any price drop (not that this is bad, if you thought it was a good buy when you bought it) And mail-in rebates, I'm sure the redemptions to sales is probably 50-60%.

And there's a certain number of people (mind it I'm not saying you are one) who will try and cheat Amazon and routinely buy and return a different item (perhaps broken or now missing parts) as a unopened item or change of mind. Just that their formula lumped you in with them. I'm sure if they can exclude that bunch they will save them money.

As a side story the saleman at WalMart told me the other day that people have actually bought a box of new ammunition and returned a box of home-reloaded ammo for credit.

[Russianwolf]

I'm probably the least surprised here.

Way back when, I noticed that Amazon will list things at unrealistic prices then refuse to honor the price claiming it was made in Error. In any brick and mortar store if something similar happens they are required by law to honor the price advertised until they can advertise a correction. By that token Amazon should have to honor any order placed before the price can be changed. But noone seems willing to enforce the law with them. Amazon, I believe does it intentionally knowing they won't be held liable as a form of bait and switch. That's when I stopped shopping at Amazon for the most part.

So to me this is just another dishonest way of dealing with their costomers from an already dishonest company.

[ironhat]

<snip>
As a side story the saleman at WalMart told me the other day that people have actually bought a box of new ammunition and returned a box of home-reloaded ammo for credit.

There is a federal law which prohibits the return of ammunition for any reason. Just ask my SIL who now owns a worthless-to-him box of 300 Win Mag which cost him $30+. Just an FYI - no flame intended, Loring.

[LinuxRandal]

This is a time to see if someone is or can still fish the Amazon. Jeff, where are you?

[Hellrazor]

It is unfortunate, but at the end of the day, they own the business and can choose who they want to sell to.

But at the end of the same day, we control the $$ in our wallet and can choose who we want to buy from. Companies need to remember who keeps them afloat. No single person can break them, but as a group everyone sure can put a hurting on them.

[radhak]

This is a time to see if someone is or can still fish the Amazon. Jeff, where are you?

Good question - Jeffrey Schronce has not posted here since January. Anybody know what turned him off this site?