Humans and Wildlife

[JTimmons]

I need some help understanding something. Is there a wildlife playbook that says large predators are afraid of humans? Did I miss a class in high school where this was taught?

I was watching a recording on my DVR last night and it picked up some of the local news. Two mountain lion encounters up in the foothills. One a familiy's shetland pony was killed and the other a mountain lion sat and watched a woman in her house. When she went for a closer look it sprang forward toward a window and swiped at it.

In the interniew with her husband he said, "we were playing by the rules, but the mountain lion wasn't."

A couple of weeks ago, I read an article where I guy killed a grizzly with a hunting knife, can't recall where it was, but he said he was spotting hunting spots when he walked up on a mother and her cubs.

During her charge he said, "he took off the hood he was wearing so that she could see he was a human thinking she'd run away."

WHERE in the world does it say they should be afraid of us? The only thing that makes dominant in this world is we have thumbs. I have heard several others say it too in reference to wildlife, "they won't attack us because we are humans."

The shark attack victims are no better, they are actually shocked when attacked that it even happened to them. Total disregard for the sign on the beach that warns sharks are present.

The way I see it, if we ain't got a gun, we're gonna be lunch when we are out there in their world.

[Anna]

I agree, but then I read a story like this.

A grandmother is being hailed as a hero for rescuing her four-year-old granddaughter from a backyard bear attack in B.C.'s West Kootenay region in which the bear cut both with swipes of its paw.

Nelson-area resident Jane Tillotson was spending a quiet day in her garden with her two visiting granddaughters, aged four and six, when she heard the youngest one, Megan Chapple, screaming.

"And I turned to look and she was coming up the steps of the garden, and a big black bear was right behind her," Tillotson told CBC News on Wednesday, speaking to the media for the first time about the Aug. 24 attack.

The black bear swiped the girl with its paw as she tried to escape up the steps, slicing the back of her calf.

"She started crying and fell down. And the bear was moving right over her."

Tillotson raced forward and plucked Megan from between the bear's paws, she said. As the grandmother backed away, the bear came after them and swiped them both, cutting the woman's thigh and her granddaughter's belly.

With Megan in one hand and the six-year-old granddaughter in the other, Tillotson stared the bear in its eyes and began screaming.

What felt like a long minute passed, Tillotson said, and the bear wandered off.

As for the widespread notion that animals do not want to harm humans, I blame Disney.

[DonHo]

"The only thing that makes dominant in this world is we have thumbs. I have heard several others say it too in reference to wildlife, "they won't attack us because we are humans.""

Thumbs are good but the ability to think and make guns would seem to be even more important in making us dominant. I guess these animals you referenced weren't smart enough to know we can make guns Of course the mother bear would defend her cubs against anything she thought might be a threat so maybe she wasn't dumb.

DonHo

[Slik Geek]

Is there a wildlife playbook that says large predators are afraid of humans?

Current "political correctness" purports that only humans are vicious and animals really don't want to hurt humans. This mentality is played repeatedly in our culture, and I suspect has contributed to this expectation among many.

There was a medium-sized dog in a former neighborhood that would viciously attack his yard's chain link fence when people walked by. (Growling, barking, jumping into the fence, biting the fence - not at all timid - he was vicious in his manner). One day I walked by and noticed that the fence had been partially removed for construction work. The dog saw me, looked at the opening in the fence, back at me, and then headed for the opening.

He came at me just like he would previously, except this time there was nothing between us and I was sure that his teeth would be in my flesh in a moment. I had about five seconds to figure out what to do - I was sure that serious injury awaited me if I wasn't effective in my response.

Just as he got close, I leaned toward him, raised my arms up, put a mean expression on my face, and made the loudest scream/growl you can imagine. It worked - he was completely intimidated and ran back into his yard.

My throat hurt, I could hear my "voice" echoing for a surprisingly long time throughout the neighborhood.

I suspect that I got lucky. If he was bigger, or was a hungry, wild animal, I might not have intimidated him. I don't have any foolish expectation that a wild animal won't attack under the right circumstances.

[Black wallnut]

A big thanks to Walt Disney and the way he portrayed the animal kingdom. The publics distaste for proven methods of hunting that have kept some predatory species in check has caused an unnatural increase in these populations. Encroachment of wildlife habitat has also increased the incendences of wildlife v mankind encounters. Since there are no easy answers I expect to see more and more encounters that turn out badly for both us and the animals.

My state has made the cost of adding bear and cougar tag to ones license very small and yet the actual success ratios are much smaller and the number of these critters harvested has decreased since more restrictive hunting method laws went into effect. The public can not have it both ways: either we hunters kill them or they maim and or kill and devour you. To make it harder for hunters to harvest just makes more of them. Encrachment of their habitat forces them to move elsewhere for food and shelter or worse find a new human based food source; that being people or peoples crops, garbage, or a combination of the above.

[JTimmons]

Of course the mother bear would defend her cubs against anything she thought might be a threat so maybe she wasn't dumb.
DonHo

Exactly, mountain lions have been known to drop an elk, so what in the world makes a person think they should be any different.

As far as I am concerned we are easy pray, we can't climb real well, run that fast and we don't have any horns, claws or fangs. Take away the possibility of having a gun and we're screwed when the bear/mountain lion is choosing between the human or the large elk with horns for lunch.

[Ed62]

I've seen people walk right up into a herd of buffalo to take pictures at Yellowstone. Encounters like that just beg for bad things to happen.

Ed

[ironhat]

I have known three men who were attacked by whitetail deer during rutting (mating) season. They get a bit nutty since only have a few weeks to be sexually active... wouldn't you? (LOL) In each case no one was hurt because they side-stepped behind a tree and Mr Horny (I mean the antlers) went running by them and stopping a few yards later and looking about with confusion while the guys slid around to the other side of the tree to escape.

[Uncle Cracker]

The only thing predictable about a wild animal is that they are unpredictable. The more they lose their fear of humans, the more dangerous they become. Animals that stalk and kill livestock and humans usually are doing it because they are old, injured, or there is a shortage of natural prey. Intrusion into natural habitats has exacerbated the problem, as has the fencing of open ranges.

[LCHIEN]

Its not the opposable thumbs that give us our relative high spot in the pecking order but our large brains that enabled making and using tools and the higher organizational capabilities that allow us to pool resources in a constructive way. Once we had the ability to conceive of tools then the opposable thumbs evolved completely to maximize the use of tools.

If not for the tools and superior brains we would just be items in the food chain. able to catch and eat things smaller and or slower than us and being eaten by things bigger and faster than us.

[LinuxRandal]

Monkee's have been observed using tools (basic rocks to break things), and also have opposible thumbs. Just goes to show the way the brain works and develops plays a BIG part.

That said, there is still a lot we don't know about our brains. We are still learning how babies brains develop, and I saw some stuff recently on how talking and language appears to have a bigger impact then they previously thought (still studying).

So by that instance, even language plays a part (a big part if you ask me, otherwise you tend to have to learn how to use tools in different communities. No one from z to go visit Y and show them)


All that said, we are still in the food chain. Just normally worms and other insects that get us. (with the occasional shark, bear, tiger, etc)

[cwsmith]

I used to spend a lot of time "in the field", as we used to say. Also spent a little over ten years in the Civil Air Patrol, doing a lot of search and rescue... well, actually mostly search!

One of the things that I have always been amazed at is the simple-minded behaviour of most humans when it comes to self preservation. It is very rare that humans give any consideration to the fact that they may be in danger.

There are so many horror stories that I have seen or heard over the years and many people simply don't get it.
for example, despite all of our parenting and "life lessons", our son has always had a bit of wanderlust. As he got older and as his horizons expanded, we never quite knew where he was going to be or where he might call us from. I remember his travel adventures the summer after college graduation. We'd get a call from him every day and all too often it would be someplace different from where he said he'd be. I'd always argue the point... "What are your Mother and I supposed to do if we don't hear from you tomorrow? If you say you are going from "A" to "B", where are we supposed to have the police start searching...when in fact you've decided to go to "G" instead. You've got to let people know where you are going!"

So, on of those afternoons, we get another adventurous, "Hi Dad, guess where I'm at?" phone calls. My cautious, "Where?" was answered by, "I'm up on some mountain in Yosemite National Park... you can't believe the view from up here!"

With a quick flurry of questions from me, it was determined that he was all alone, about an hour's walk from his car, up some trail. No water, no food, no weapon of any sort... just his his cloths, his wallet, and his cell phone!. Scared the h3!! right out of me.

Not that it might help too much, but I told him to grab the biggest stick he could find and get his butt back to his car just as quickly as he could. Thank heaven, we got a call from him about 45 minutes later. I spent some time with him that evening, reading him the riot act.

Now, this was a kid who was always cautioned, warned, and continually told that "nature" isn't hospitable. One needs to be aware and prepared for any surprises. I guess it's simply uncompehensible for some of us to believe that we could get caught by the weather, or worse... not be the top of the local food chain!

CWS

[LCHIEN]

I used to spend a lot of time "in the field", as we used to say. Also spent a little over ten years in the Civil Air Patrol, doing a lot of search and rescue... well, actually mostly search!

One of the things that I have always been amazed at is the simple-minded behaviour of most humans when it comes to self preservation. It is very rare that humans give any consideration to the fact that they may be in danger.

There are so many horror stories that I have seen or heard over the years and many people simply don't get it.
for example, despite all of our parenting and "life lessons", our son has always had a bit of wanderlust. As he got older and as his horizons expanded, we never quite knew where he was going to be or where he might call us from. I remember his travel adventures the summer after college graduation. We'd get a call from him every day and all too often it would be someplace different from where he said he'd be. I'd always argue the point... "What are your Mother and I supposed to do if we don't hear from you tomorrow? If you say you are going from "A" to "B", where are we supposed to have the police start searching...when in fact you've decided to go to "G" instead. You've got to let people know where you are going!"

So, on of those afternoons, we get another adventurous, "Hi Dad, guess where I'm at?" phone calls. My cautious, "Where?" was answered by, "I'm up on some mountain in Yosemite National Park... you can't believe the view from up here!"

With a quick flurry of questions from me, it was determined that he was all alone, about an hour's walk from his car, up some trail. No water, no food, no weapon of any sort... just his his cloths, his wallet, and his cell phone!. Scared the h3!! right out of me.

Not that it might help too much, but I told him to grab the biggest stick he could find and get his butt back to his car just as quickly as he could. Thank heaven, we got a call from him about 45 minutes later. I spent some time with him that evening, reading him the riot act.

Now, this was a kid who was always cautioned, warned, and continually told that "nature" isn't hospitable. One needs to be aware and prepared for any surprises. I guess it's simply uncompehensible for some of us to believe that we could get caught by the weather, or worse... not be the top of the local food chain!

CWS

Chuck, i've always marveled at the natural instinct to wander in most animals, homo-erectus or otherwise. It's nature's way of spreading the species to new areas. Countless animals die hitching a ride on trees floating across the ocean, Less than one tenth of percent make it alive to some new land but those that do evolve to new lineages and civilizations or branches of their species. Many explorers set out searching for new lands, most died, Columbus did not leave a forwarding address when he went to the new world. Turtles crawl across busy streets not knowing what awaits if he makes it there. I think its a natural thing that has been blunted by our new "no man should die every life is precious" approach. Its unique in nature, life and death go hand in hand, life's a lottery for most members of the species, a slight advantage to the strong and smart make them evolve for the better.

Should something happen to your son, its no relief but I think you are seeing natural instincts coing out in your son, it may be something you can't do much about.

[cwsmith]

Thanks Loring,

I understand full well, as there's always that yearning to discover a new horizon. But as a father, it's made me a prayerful man.

I often wonder what my mother and father may have thought as I too would take off for wherever. But I always went with some preparation, just in case. My parents knew that.

One late winter night I took a back road short cut and got my VW stuck in a drift. I was about two miles from the nearest house. Stupid of me for sure, as I knew the weather was terrible. But I had my pack and sleeping bag (always kept it in the car as we never knew when we might be called out for a search). I ended up spending the night in the car on a windy, sub-zero night. But when the snow plow came around 9:00 the next morning, I was able to offer the driver a hot chocolate and a slice of brown bread.

After that, I learned to file a "flight plan" and stick to it. So even today, when ever we travel, I keep a black bag with food, water, first aid, and communications capabilities. I also keep an emergency tool kit for the car. Better safe than sorry. I hate to hear stories like the poor guy and his family who got lost in Oregon last winter.

CWS

[Anna]

Chuck, i've always marveled at the natural instinct to wander in most animals, homo-erectus or otherwise. It's nature's way of spreading the species to new areas. Countless animals die hitching a ride on trees floating across the ocean, Less than one tenth of percent make it alive to some new land but those that do evolve to new lineages and civilizations or branches of their species. Many explorers set out searching for new lands, most died, Columbus did not leave a forwarding address when he went to the new world. Turtles crawl across busy streets not knowing what awaits if he makes it there. I think its a natural thing that has been blunted by our new "no man should die every life is precious" approach. Its unique in nature, life and death go hand in hand, life's a lottery for most members of the species, a slight advantage to the strong and smart make them evolve for the better.

So that is the answer to that age old question of why the chicken crossed the street.