What is the difference between C2 and C3?

[SHADOWFOX]

I see a lot of router bit set that says C2 Tungsten Carbide Router Bit Set and the others C3 Tungsten Carbide Router bit Set. What is the difference? Is one better than the other?

[gmack5]

Yes there is a difference, as far as I know, the C3 is much finer grained and therefore will hold an edge longer.

There may be other differences that I'm not aware of, maybe some others will chime in.........

[final_t]

quote:Originally posted by gmack5

Yes there is a difference, as far as I know, the C3 is much finer grained and therefore will hold an edge longer.

There may be other differences that I'm not aware of, maybe some others will chime in.........

That's pretty much all there is to it. But if you want to get *technical* about it:
C2 is 12%-10% Cobalt (Co) and 88%-90% Tungsten Carbide (WC), whereas
C3 is 10%-8% Co and 90%-92% WC.
C2 is actually harder than C3. C1 and C2 grades are used to cut Titanium.

My take: the finer the grain of WC is what you're probably shooting for, since in theory, it will be less likely to be heat & stress fracture. However, all things considered, I doubt any of us would be able to tell the difference in use between C2 and C3 bits from the *same* vendor. But get a C3 from MLCS and a C2 from HF and you go fig which one is better.

[LCHIEN]

you start to get into issues like hardness vs brittleness.
One is harder and will last longer but its also easier to chip
a tooth that will require repair.

So harder does not necessarily mean it will last longer if you have to have it repaired because a tooth chipped. Its a tradeoff.

Then to complicate matters there's probably good and bad
quality of each C2 and C3. Things like impurities and metalurgical problems.

[SHADOWFOX]

So for routing purposes would a C3 tungsten carbide be better than the C2? or does it not matter?

[sweensdv]

As long as the bit is sharp, it doesn't matter.

[LCHIEN]

quote:Originally posted by SHADOWFOX

So for routing purposes would a C3 tungsten carbide be better than the C2? or does it not matter?

Sort of like asking if apples or oranges are better for you.
C3 might be prefereable to hold a sharp edge longer, but good C2 would be better than bad C3.
But If you are tough on bits it would be easier to chip a C3 if they ever touch anything but wood even when not being turned.

In practice I don't worry about which C2 or C3 but just buy bits
from reputable vendors.

[LCHIEN]

C4: Hardest grade, high wear resistance, no shock or impact encountered; wear bushings and nozzles.

C3: High abrasion resistance, little shock resistance; small drawing dies, coating and compacting dies, bushings, machines parts and valve parts.

C2: General Purpose wear resistance, where only light shock is encountered; small dies and mandrels, nonferrous wire and tube drawing, nozzles, seal rings and powder compacting dies.

C1: Good wear resistance, nonferrous drawing, light blanking dies, mandrels, wear rings, high pressure parts, wood working blades, valve stems and seats, knives, bearings, grippers and guides.

source:
http://www.federalcarbide.com/grades.html

[sneezer17301]

the harder carbides are also more difficult to braze to a substrate without cracking them in the process. learned that.... the hard way!

[Holbren]

C3 carbide is a harder carbide than C2 but good C2 is better than poor quality C3. What is as important if not more than the hardness is the particle size. Usually C3 will have a smaller particle than C2 but not always. The way a router bit dulls is the bit heats up from friction and the particles flake off rounding over the edge. The smaller the particle flaking off, the longer the bit will last before that rounding effect takes place.

The better bits use silver braising and some of the less expensive ones will use copper braising.

My suggestion is if you use a bit every day, buy the best one you can afford. If you have a one time user for a single project, that is your chance to try a less expensive bit that will more than likely do the job.

Brian