Which Sander for wall prep to repaint?

[leehljp]

One of my first projects when returning to the States will be to sand the walls and repaint in several of the rooms, starting with the kitchen. I will be getting a Fein Turbo 3 Vac due to its low noise, portability, dust control and high vac rate. Got that approved already from LOML.

What will be the best sander for the type of work as noted in "Background" below?

Background:
Back in 2005, LOML and I repainted the kitchen. We cleaned the walls but did not sand them in most places. The paint started pealing off in large pieces in different places last winter. We were not there when it happened (over about 4 weeks) but our daughter was. I saw the spots last May when in the States. At first, LOML wanted to tear out the current sheetrock (which dates back to the '50s), and re-sheetrock the kitchen but I don't. She finally agreed that it would be too much. So, we want to sand the walls down through at least a couple of levels of paint and re-paint it - correctly. If we do this, we will use the sander for the living room and dining room too. We don't want wallpaper.

WHICH TYPE Sander? STRAIGHT LINE or ROUND RANDOM ORBITAL?
Brand recommend?
Which type of sander works best in this kind of situation with a vac, and eats through layers of paint fairly fast?
Does it eat through Wall paper that has been painted over?

Almost Forgot to mention: Keeping DUST to an absolute minimum is imperative. That is the reason that LOML has pre-approved a very good and moderately quiet Vac system, even at a near $500 price for the whole outfit. Allergies require this.

SANDPAPER?
What is the lowest sandpaper to use? I figured 40 - 50 grit followed by 80 and then 120 or so?

TIPS from experience?

THANKS.

[bigstick509]

In the past I have had success with a Random Orbital Sander attached to a shopvac with a HEPA filter. This has used to sand drywall repair areas, not to remove layers of paint but it should work just fine. Just on a much larger scale. Regarding the painted wall paper, I would use a Paper Tiger http://www.amazon.com/Zinsser-2966-P.../dp/B0000DI7WP to score the paper and then strip the wall before sanding. Good Luck

[leehljp]

In the past I have had success with a Random Orbital Sander attached to a shopvac with a HEPA filter. This has used to sand drywall repair areas, not to remove layers of paint but it should work just fine. Just on a much larger scale. Regarding the painted wall paper, I would use a Paper Tiger http://www.amazon.com/Zinsser-2966-P.../dp/B0000DI7WP to score the paper and then strip the wall before sanding. Good Luck

I will have to give that a try. Being over here so long, I know I have missed out on learning about some tools! Thanks.

[eccentrictinkerer]

I've been confronted with the same problem in several customer's homes.

I've found that removal of the loose paint and a light sanding followed by a skim coat of 'spackle' gives the best results for smooth walls.

Sheetrock tapers are very reasonable. I usually pay less than a dollar a square foot.

[frumper64]

If you do decide to skim coat the walls, be sure to look at a thing called the "Magic Trowel". It's a squeegee looking thing with a soft rubber edge and gives a great smooth finish. Even I was able to get a good finish skim coating with this thing and that is saying something given my lack of sheet-rock skills.

[Charlie R]

Before buying consider renting at a paint & wallpaper store. They have sanders on long extensions with suction fittings and vacuums intended for smoothing wallboard joints.
Good luck. We appreciate your many quality posts.

[Tom Slick]

Latex paint doesn't respond well to sanding and it clogs the paper. I second eccentrictinkerer suggestion. It's what I did in a recent bathroom remodel.

[Mr__Bill]

With 1950's drywall I expect it has the same vintage electrical, plumbing and insulation. You may be time, money and effort ahead just re-doing the kitchen.

I have tried to sand walls that were not properly prepped for paint and where it started to scale off. I found that far too often I was through the paint and paper into the gypsum sooner than I ever thought possible and the rest of the time it took forever to just get down to a painted surface that I thought may be solid. For me it would have been far less work to have just hung new drywall.

Your experience may vary and the cost of a new floor and kitchen cabinets may push the price up a bit but having the walls insulated, and the electrical updated and the sink moved to where you may think it should be should make for a much better kitchen. While you are at it might as well put in a new window too.

Bill
it ain't good advice unless it involves more work...

[leehljp]

With 1950's drywall I expect it has the same vintage electrical, plumbing and insulation. You may be time, money and effort ahead just re-doing the kitchen.

I have tried to sand walls that were not properly prepped for paint and where it started to scale off. I found that far too often I was through the paint and paper into the gypsum sooner than I ever thought possible and the rest of the time it took forever to just get down to a painted surface that I thought may be solid. For me it would have been far less work to have just hung new drywall.

Your experience may vary and the cost of a new floor and kitchen cabinets may push the price up a bit but having the walls insulated, and the electrical updated and the sink moved to where you may think it should be should make for a much better kitchen. While you are at it might as well put in a new window too.

Bill
it ain't good advice unless it involves more work...

Bill, you are reading my mind. I guess I have a lot to do.

My fear of feather smoothing the edges is that after doing it right again, the paint will pop off in other areas. One thing that I did not mention above is that since the winter of 2007, my daughter who lives there rarely uses the kitchen and keeps the door closed from heat and air conditioning. She doesn't use the kitchen much and eats out considerably. I have been wondering if that temp drop into the 40s and staying there in the kitchen for two months or so had any effect on the paint popping off.

After the suggestions, I will definitely consider re-sheet rocking the whole kitchen. We had new counters put in back in '05, so that is set and we can and will use that. LOML does want new cabinets but we didn't want to do that for a couple of years.

AS to re-wiring, that is a necessity and I will have the wire. I have a friend over here that is an electrical genius and worked at a nuclear power plant as a technician in the US. He brought a dozen 50 ft rolls of US wire with him when he came to Japan in 2006 to rewire a house here. He rewired his house with dual voltages - 100 and 120 so that he could use some US appliances. The Japanese would not let him use the US wire for the 100V side. SO, I worked out a deal with him and gave him about 120 bd ft of oak, walnut, cherry and maple for 5 rolls of US Romex 14 and 2 rolls of 12.

On top of that, as you mentioned flooring - that needs to be re-done also.

Since wiring is in the works (just wasn't expecting it so soon), so I may as well look at re-sheetrocking, and flooring too, but I sure hate to do that. I am still going to get my low noise Fein Vac!

[chopnhack]

Hank, if you do intend to continue with repair, they sell sandpaper for drywall, its actually sanding mesh, looks like screen material for doors and windows. It is perfect for sanding down drywall compound and doesn't clog. I bet that would do wonders for your latex issue. It also obviously has better dust extraction capabilities. As for repair, once you are down to as bare as you can get, put down 1-2 coats of a good quality primer, like kilz, benjamin moore or even behr. That should seal and bond well. As long as your not having an ongoing moisture migration issue, that should solve your problem. Blistering latex is usually a sign of moisture moving through the wall. Do you have a roof leak or perhaps poor insulation during severe temp/humidity differences between inside and out? HTH, best of luck.

[leehljp]

Hank, if you do intend to continue with repair, they sell sandpaper for drywall, its actually sanding mesh, looks like screen material for doors and windows. It is perfect for sanding down drywall compound and doesn't clog. I bet that would do wonders for your latex issue. It also obviously has better dust extraction capabilities. As for repair, once you are down to as bare as you can get, put down 1-2 coats of a good quality primer, like kilz, benjamin moore or even behr. That should seal and bond well. As long as your not having an ongoing moisture migration issue, that should solve your problem. Blistering latex is usually a sign of moisture moving through the wall. Do you have a roof leak or perhaps poor insulation during severe temp/humidity differences between inside and out? HTH, best of luck.

No moisture on the walls because the walls areas that peeled are inside walls. Dining room one side, bedroom behind. One wall is an outside wall but no problem there so far. I did mention that my daughter kept the heat off most of the time in the winter for the kitchen, dining room and living room area.

Thanks for the suggestion of the sanding mesh. I will take all of this information and process it. I will re-wire the kitchen and do the floors but If I could get out of re-sheetrocking it, I would feel better about it. The rewiring is mostly in the areas where whole sheets of sheet rock are not needed. There is only one outlet in the two walls where the paint is peeling off.

I appreciate everyone's suggestions! They are all helpful.

[DrChas]

I have sanded walls with a random orbit sander. When sanding drywall I use a "sand and kleen" water trap connected to the dust port of the sander. This really traps dust well, but is a bit of a mess to clean up. What it has is a standard vortex but it runs above water so the water traps most of the dust before it gets to the sander. When sanding drywall with this system you still get dust everywhere, but thats more because there is SO much dust with dry wall rather than because it doesn't work.

http://www.amazon.com/MT800-Sand-Kle.../dp/B00005A1K8

[woodturner]

IWhen sanding drywall with this system you still get dust everywhere, but thats more because there is SO much dust with dry wall rather than because it doesn't work.

For "sanding" drywall joints, it works much, much better to use a damp sponge to smooth the joints - and there is NO dust!

Obviously, a sponge won't work for paint or sanding the surface of the drywall.

[natausch]

I'd second looking into professionals to do the sanding and spackling.

The BIGGEST issue is if your house dates back to the 50's hidden under two or three coats of latex paint will be the five or six layers of lead based paint. It was as common as butter in kitchens back then.

If you do proceed yourself you'll need to wear a full face resperator, protective gear, seal the kitchen from the rest of the house, low micron filter vac, an air cleaner to remove airborne dust and beyond thoroughly clean after you've finished.

Something less agressive than a ROS with 40-80 grit would also be advised, there's a jitterbug style drywall screen sander you can rent with a vacuum hookup that should feather well.

[woodturner]

The BIGGEST issue is if your house dates back to the 50's hidden under two or three coats of latex paint will be the five or six layers of lead based paint. It was as common as butter in kitchens back then.

In some areas, lead paint was common, not so much in others. I have had my 1930's era house tested, and it does not have lead paint anywhere. It has not been removed, it was just never used much in this area for interior paint, and the exterior is brick.

The REQUIREMENTS for lead paint removal vary by state. In some states, the requirements are quite strict, others not so much. Lead is primarily an issue for children.

It's always prudent, IMHO, to wear a respirator when creating dust and fumes. However, in my state, lead paint removal by the homeowner does not require any special equipment or protection. I can legally get out there in my shorts with a belt sander if I want. In practice, short term exposure to the small to moderate quantities of lead produced by paint removal is not harmful to adults.