Tool price increases

[BigguyZ]

Wow, this thread has nothing to do with tools....

[gjat]

I don't know any $9/hour jobs which require a four-year degree.

Teachers...

[cgallery]

Teachers...

I see you are from Florida.

http://www.teachersalaryinfo.com/ave...y-florida.html

The average teacher salary is $45,296. Benefits are another $0.25 per dollar, bring the total average compensation to about $56k. There are (on average) about 180 school days per year. Adding another 15 days for days when teachers are in school where kids aren't, that is 195 days. If we figure 8 hour days, teachers are making approx. $35/hour.

What if teachers worked 12 hour days, grading papers at home, etc. Well, they're still making about $24/hour.

In fact, teachers in Florida would have to work 120 hours a week, 52 weeks a year in order to only earn $9/hour.

I like teachers. Many of my good friends are teachers. My kids have had outstanding teachers, as did I while I was growing up. I think teachers should be well compensated. Teachers that work at unsafe schools (know a few of those, too) should also be sainted.

But no, they don't make $9/hour.

[woodturner]

They sold out to Unilever for something like $300M, and had "insignificant liabilities" at the time of the sale, which means they pocketed most of that $300M. Not exactly struggling.

At the time of the unilever sale, they were struggling, according to analysts. My understanding is that they sold the company because of the problems, which seems reasonable given the low sale price.

Workers paid to much in relation to what?

Market value for their work

The system worked until we started dollar cost averaging in labor from countries where the weekly pay scale is $40.

I agree that it worked, to a limited degree.

Regardless, we now live in a global economy. If the market value of labor is $40, then that is it's value.

Here is a question - say two local farmers sell an egg, one in New York, the other in New Delhi. Say the New York farmer sell his egg for $1, and the New Delhi farmer sells his egg for 10 cents. What is the difference? What is the real value of the egg? The egg is the same, only the market is different.

Where workers are essentially slaves and have no right to pursue life, liberty, or happiness.

But that usually is not the case. Many of these workers are paid very well by their local standards and live quite well.

I don't know any $9/hour jobs which require a four-year degree.

Accounting, many positions in business, etc. Starting lawyers often make in this range, if they can find a job, not even considering the overtime.

Agreed. But there are still a lot of people just want to own any house, and drive any safe, reliable car.

But again, those are luxuries, not entitlements.

[gjat]

I see you are from Florida.

http://www.teachersalaryinfo.com/ave...y-florida.html

The average teacher salary is $45,296. Benefits are another $0.25 per dollar, bring the total average compensation to about $56k. There are (on average) about 180 school days per year. Adding another 15 days for days when teachers are in school where kids aren't, that is 195 days. If we figure 8 hour days, teachers are making approx. $35/hour.

What if teachers worked 12 hour days, grading papers at home, etc. Well, they're still making about $24/hour.

In fact, teachers in Florida would have to work 120 hours a week, 52 weeks a year in order to only earn $9/hour.

I like teachers. Many of my good friends are teachers. My kids have had outstanding teachers, as did I while I was growing up. I think teachers should be well compensated. Teachers that work at unsafe schools (know a few of those, too) should also be sainted.

But no, they don't make $9/hour.

It was a little facetious. But the starting salary for teachers in Polk and Hillsborough Counties is around $30k. The average salary is a farce, because that includes what all the school 'administration' is getting paid. It's not the average classroom teacher is making. Working about 50 hours a week on average, since they've eliminated planning periods, block schedules, and have them teaching 6 classes a day, making calls and parent appointments after schools hours, etc. Then give them 12 weeks off, working 40 weeks at 55 hours (calculation Over Time for over 40), that's 2,200 hours of pay, equals $13.64 and hour. (I have family that are teachers) Certainly closer to $9 then $24. Throw in the fact these Counties don't segregate 'special needs' any more, and picture that teacher has 35% of their 32 kids with some sort of behviorial or learning disorder. Not a great living. How many people working making $24 an hour can claim they deserve to be a little lazier on their job because their boss that runs a corporation employing 10,000 people makes "too much" when they consider what the person educating their kids make? Basically, too many people believe they work harder and get paid less than anyone else when the reality is, the majority of us are getting treated fairly well.

[cgallery]

At the time of the unilever sale, they were struggling, according to analysts. My understanding is that they sold the company because of the problems, which seems reasonable given the low sale price.

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/$326+m...out-a064005819

They were publicly listed. Stock was trading at $35 and Unilever offered $43. They had little debt. Board went for it.

I agree that it worked, to a limited degree.

Regardless, we now live in a global economy. If the market value of labor is $40, then that is it's value.

Here is a question - say two local farmers sell an egg, one in New York, the other in New Delhi. Say the New York farmer sell his egg for $1, and the New Delhi farmer sells his egg for 10 cents. What is the difference? What is the real value of the egg? The egg is the same, only the market is different.

When was the last time you purchased eggs? They're between sixty and ninety cents a dozen here.

The New Delhi eggs maybe less expensive (I kinda doubt it). Will you get Salmonella eating one? What are the environmental costs associated with the ND egg?

But that usually is not the case. Many of these workers are paid very well by their local standards and live quite well.

"By local standards."

Accounting, many positions in business, etc. Starting lawyers often make in this range, if they can find a job, not even considering the overtime.

http://www.payscale.com/research/US/..._Lawyer/Salary

Starting attorney, $45-$69k/year.

But again, those are luxuries, not entitlements.

No argument. But it seems they were luxuries we could once afford, but no longer can.

My question is, what are the hidden costs of global trade? We all love big screen TV's and fast notebook computers for cheap. But what are the hidden costs, and how long can this go on?

It seems to me that there is a catch-22 here. Production slowly (at first) shifted to parts of Asia, where labor was less expensive, and environmental concerns non-existent. Those products were in turn shipped back to the world's largest free market (the U.S.) where we scarfed-up tools and electronics at deep discounts. But as manufacturing jobs here are replaced with manufacturing jobs "there," the pool of consumers that can afford those products shrinks, and a vicious cycle ensues.

[woodturner]

They were publicly listed.

Maybe I'm confusing them with another company, but I really thought they were on the verge of bankruptcy.

When was the last time you purchased eggs? They're between sixty and ninety cents a dozen here.

The New Delhi eggs maybe less expensive (I kinda doubt it). Will you get Salmonella eating one? What are the environmental costs associated with the ND egg?

It was an example, not intended to be a price comparison. But where do you live that eggs are less than a dollar a dozen? I can tell you that around here - in the midwest, close to the chicken farms - they are in the $1.50 a dozen range.

Maybe I didn't make my point clearly enough. My point was that an object has some intrinsic worth - but that same object costs less in some parts of the world, more in others. Why? It's arguably because it is overpriced in some parts of the world.

"By local standards."
Starting attorney, $45-$69k/year.

Maybe high GPA students at major firms - but our law school reported more starting salaries in the $12K range last Spring than the $20K range. In fairness, some of those were for public defender positions - lousy pay, great experience if you want to pursue the prosecutor or judge tracks.

No argument. But it seems they were luxuries we could once afford, but no longer can.

I don't think they were ever luxuries we could afford - or at least not everyone. Most factory workers in the 1920's did not own homes - they rented, or the company gave them housing. It has been widely reported that the average house size has doubled since the 1950's. Like our food, our housing and expectations have "supersized". In the 1950's, most young people did not expect to start out in a home - and when they bought a home, it was typically an older 900 square foot fixer upper. Today, people starting out feel "entitled" to a 2400 squre foot new home, two SUVs, etc.

Production slowly (at first) shifted to parts of Asia, where labor was less expensive, and environmental concerns non-existent. Those products were in turn shipped back to the world's largest free market (the U.S.) where we scarfed-up tools and electronics at deep discounts. But as manufacturing jobs here are replaced with manufacturing jobs "there," the pool of consumers that can afford those products shrinks, and a vicious cycle ensues.

Manufacturing is not the issue - it's that we (the US) have stopped innovating. We can never compete in manufacturing in many areas, nor should we - it's a commodity business. Where we should focus our efforts is in innovation - where we can command the kinds of premiums we must have to support our bloated economy.

[chopnhack]

It seems to me that there is a catch-22 here. Production slowly (at first) shifted to parts of Asia, where labor was less expensive, and environmental concerns non-existent. Those products were in turn shipped back to the world's largest free market (the U.S.) where we scarfed-up tools and electronics at deep discounts. But as manufacturing jobs here are replaced with manufacturing jobs "there," the pool of consumers that can afford those products shrinks, and a vicious cycle ensues.

Seem's like the Wal-Mart paradigm

[cwsmith]

BAck to the original subject, for what it's worth (probably nothing):

I was in Home Depot yesterday and notice the price on several tools have increased. For example, the Ridgid foldings stand saw is up $50 to $500 and the Ryobi BTS21 is $20 higher than it was last month, now priced at $270.

CWS

[Mr__Bill]

Another thing to consider on tool prices. When times were good they could sell more product with a lower profit per tool. As the economy went sour there was too much product in the distribution line and prices were dropped to reduce inventory on hand. Now with reduced sales and the inventory at a manageable level the price is back up, and to maintain profits the price increases. Is it greed or is the manufacturer and local store just trying to stay in business?

Bill