Jointer technique

[SwingKing]

I was surfacing some QSWO over the weekend and had a couple questions I thought I'd throw out. I have a Grizzly G1182 6" jointer and I was working with 8' rough boards, so they were a pain, even with extra infeed/outfeed support.

When face jointing, when do you stop? The QSWO I was cleaning up had some hollows in the face, so I spent a lot of time removing material from the edges to get a decent surface. Once I got to a point where there was flat surface on both edges, I decided to switch over to the planer to finish the surfacing. Does this sound reasonable or do you completely flatten one face/edge before moving to the planer?

Part of the problem is I'm not happy with my jointer technique. For some reason, when I joint a reasonable uniform board, the final result is wedge shape. For the QSWO, after jointing I had an 1/8" difference in the thickness of the board when I was done. It's like I'm putting more pressure on one side of the board than the other. I guess another option could be one of the knives is not parallel to the jointer bed. Any one ever have this problem or have any suggestions?

Thanks!

-- Ken

[LCHIEN]

I would completely flatten one face... although if there's a hollow so that the wood is supported all around, then the planer will work as soon as you get all four edges of the face planer.

As for wedge-shaped face planes, I get that even though I've got mine tweaked to make a flat face. Not sure if I don't have it completely tweaked perfectly, but I just reverse the dirction of feed every few passes to solve that.

[BasementDweller]

I second that. I had the same problem when I started using my jointer. I know reverse the board every few passes and it comes out nice and flat! And yes, I also make a flat face, then reference that face on the fence and make a flat edge. Then thickness plane, the rip to width.

One other tip. I find that I need to do all of that pretty close to the same day. If I leave a lot of time in between I can get fresh board warping from exposing inner (lesser dried) sections of wood.


- BD

[poolhound]

I always joint the face and one edge before moving to the planer. I have never noticed a particlular wedge problem. I think it depends mostly on what shape the original stock was. IMHO if it was basically flatish there shouldnt be a problem. if it had a twist then you will end up with a wedge issue wish will be rectified once you put it through the planer.

[SwingKing]

Thanks for the comments. I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who sees the "wedge" issue. I do normally try to flip the boards around every few passes, but those 8' QSWO planks were pretty awkward to flip around in my garage so I got a bit lazy.

FYI, I do always joint one face and one edge. This whole jointer technique / setup issue was just bothering me because I ended up taking off more material on one side with the jointer. This meant more material needed to be removed by the planer and I almost had to go less than 3/4" to get both sides flat.

Next time, I'll remember to flip the boards regularly, even if it is a pain in the butt.

-- Ken

[skillybob]

There's a good article at http://www.northwestwoodworking.com/.../article1.html about your jointer problem.

The wedge problem comes from jointer setup. I know this because it was happening to me . The outfeed table was slightly higher that the cutter head. I was able to adjust this out and now get perfectly square cuts. It really does not take much to be off either - just a hair high with my setup was giving me all sorts of problems. Of course, it is also important to have good technique when using you jointer. Anyway - give it a read .

[Tom Hintz]

I get one face completely flat because the rollers on a planer can exert quite a bit of force and could "flatten" a cupped pice of wood while planing but it can spring back to cupped (maybe somewhat less cupped) when it comes out from under the rollers.

Developing a taper or wedge on the jointer is just a fact of life, especially if you take several passes. The jointer has nothing to prevent tapering since it works with only one side at a time. Good technique can minimize tapering but it will always be part of using a jointer. I have a "Basics" story on jointers at the link below if that might help.

http://www.newwoodworker.com/basic/usejntr.html

[milanuk]

I do normally try to flip the boards around every few passes, but those 8' QSWO planks were pretty awkward to flip around in my garage so I got a bit lazy.

Was there a particular reason that you couldn't cross cut the planks down to more manageable length? I realize some projects (like bed rails, long tables or benches) need the long boards, but for most other things it seems like a person can save themselves a lot of grief (in my admittedly limited experience) by cross-cutting to rough lengths and thereby not having to swing a big long board around in tight confines.

Just a thought.

Monte

[SARGE..g-47]

You have to get one side flat before going to the planer. If you know the size of the project I would cross-cut the oriiginal stock down to a few inches beyond those lenghs as mentioned by Monte. And if you have 8" widths that are cupped badly and flattening one side mean you may end up with thinner than you prefer.. I would rip the 8" stock down to 4" after getting a square edge on one side.

Cross-cutting down to the shorter size if feasible and ripping in half with re-glue in mind will save a lot of waste as opposed to trying to take the cup out of the wider original stock.

Good luck...

[poolhound]

Was there a particular reason that you couldn't cross cut the planks down to more manageable length? I realize some projects (like bed rails, long tables or benches) need the long boards, but for most other things it seems like a person can save themselves a lot of grief (in my admittedly limited experience) by cross-cutting to rough lengths and thereby not having to swing a big long board around in tight confines.

Just a thought.

Monte

Good point Monte. I had assumed (never a wise thing) Ken needed them this long. Unless my end need is for small pieces I always precut to a rough length. This actually helps with the jointing as it acts to minimize the bow or twist in a board and you end up removing less material to get one face flat.

Less jointing means less chance of seeing a taper.

Another thought - If you have a board that has a high degree of twist or cup it can sometimes be adviseable to rip it first. If you need that width then simply glue it back together. It sounds like a lot of trouble but if you really like the board it could save you from turning a 6/4 board into a 4/4 one!!

[SwingKing]

I agree with the idea of cutting down the board first, if possible. Unfortunately, the project I'm working on requires this length. I'm working on a cap for a stairway half wall (http://www.bt3central.com/showthread.php?t=40524) and the upper section is 10' long. I want the full 8' to keep the scarf joint as high as possible on the rail. I did trim the boards to just under 6" so I could properly joint the face. I decided not to cut the lower section to length because I wanted to see what the grain looked like on the finished boards before I decide which set was going on which section.

Skillybob, thanks for the link. I read thought it and it's a good reference. I don't think the wedge problem he discussed is my problem. The outfeed height problem would cause problems along the length of the board. My problem is across the width of the board when face jointing.

Tom, thanks for the newwoodworker link. There's quite a bit of good info there on tuning up a jointer. I need to go back and check everything to make it's all set up correctly. The wedge issue may not be completely avoidable, but I do want to make sure my jointer isn't making it worse.

-- Ken