Router questions

[p8ntblr]

Is there a good rule of thumb on how tight you should tighten the collet on the router? Can it be too snug?

Also can someone explain what makes the top brands (Whiteside, CMT, etc) of router bits worth the extra $$? I got a Holbren starter kit and am pretty happy with it so far. But then again I've only really used 1 bit so far . What differences would I see with a higher end brand and are those differences significant. Thanx

[LCHIEN]

I would say with a good collet, I don't have to tighten mine too much. I usually turn them by hand until they stop, then turn about 1/8 or 1/4 more turn. I don't put a "death grip" on them or anything. I find that holds them securely. If they slip or move or change height then they're too loose.

As for better bits, I think that a basic quality bit is well balanced and meets dimensional tolerances so there's no wobble or shake - runs smoothly. Most reasonable bits meet that. Next level up, better and thicker carbide. the thicker carbide buys more sharpeneings. The better carbide takes an edge better and holds it longer. THis in turn gives a cleaner cut with less chattering and a better finish for a longer time.

[Knottscott]

I would say with a good collet, I don't have to tighten mine too much. I usually turn them by hand until they stop, then turn about 1/8 or 1/4 more turn. I don't put a "death grip" on them or anything. I find that holds them securely. If they slip or move or change height then they're too loose.

As for better bits, I think that a basic quality bit is well balanced and meets dimensional tolerances so there's no wobble or shake - runs smoothly. Most reasonable bits meet that. Next level up, better and thicker carbide. the thicker carbide buys more sharpeneings. The better carbide takes an edge better and holds it longer. THis in turn gives a cleaner cut with less chattering and a better finish for a longer time.

....ditto, plus you tend to get better bearings on the more expensive bits

[ragswl4]

Bit quality vs price. I think there is a use for both types of bits, less expensive and the more expensive. I have purchased router bits from HF, Holbren, Grizzly and Whiteside.

The router bits from HF were just OK. Used them sparingly for edge forming and routing rabbets. No real problems. I had to sand the pieces that I edge formed, some quite a bit.

Holbren bits. I got that set he sold, 20 for $20. I have only used a few of them but they performed pretty good and I think was a great deal.

Grizzly bits. I think I put them in the league with HF. Bought a set that was designed for my Incra Jig for making dovetails. Worked OK but occasionally I got some tear out and had to trash that piece. They are sitting quietly in the tool cabinet waiting for.....................

First bits from Whiteside was a set designed for my Incra jig. What a difference. The router never sounded labored at all and zero tear out with perfect cuts. At the time my main projects were jewerly boxes.

Got a raised panel set from HF. Cut one panel, rails and stiles. All went to the trash. Rails and stiles did not fit tightly and panel cut was very rough and would have been labor intensive to sand. Wood went in the trash.

Next bits were from Whiteside for raised panels (vertical bit), rails and stiles. Raised panel cuts were easy and no sanding required. Used 3 passes. Rails and stiles fit perfectly with zero gap between the stile and the coped end of the rail. These three bits cost around $200. As I am making 56 raised panel doors I think the cost is insignificant compared to the amount of sanding and hassle I would go thru with lower quality bits.

I think my opinion is that if you will be using a bit or bits alot, buy the good ones Whiteside for me). If they will get occasional use then a mid-level priced bit is OK. I think Holbren falls in between Whiteside and Mid-level and his prices are very good, my opinion. If I don't buy Whiteside I will probably buy a Holbren bit. I also get my Whiteside bits from him, best price I have found.

Bottom line is buy the best for the bits you will use a lot. My $.02.

[scrollsawguy]

cheap bits are great if their cheap enoth to chuck them after 5 uses. in canada they is alot of cheap bits on the market,,a rabbiting bit is 12 buks,,,i usually buy new bits for each piece of furniture i build, use em til there no longer cutting n send them back to the supplyer. he will give you a deal on the next bunch, because he just adds a new cutter onto the wasted bit. cheaper for u, n cheaper for him. the only expensive bits i have are for panel rail and stile building,,hate to get knicks in a good door.

[JimD]

I usually buy MLCS because of their free shipping and my general satisfaction with the bits. I have a couple whiteside and I think they are better but not usually worth the extra price to me. One bit I think you need to get a better bit for is a dovetail bit for half blind dovetail jigs. They have a quarter inch shank and a 1/2 wide dovetail 14 degrees. I have broken a couple cheaper ones right at the bottom of the dovetail where it is thinnest. I do not think it was properly heat treated. My current one is from CMT and is working well.

The tests I have seen pretty consistently comment whiteside bits will give you less sanding to do. I use MLCS raised panel bits and find the degree of sanding to be acceptable, however.

Jim

[eddy merckx]

FWW did a test last year, where they used straight bits from a range of companies to cut dados in melamine shelving ( I think). They ranked the bits on chipping and tearout, also how many feet they could cut before failure.

There were huge differences, with Whiteside being at the top. They clearly outlasted the cheaper bits. Some of the familiar brands like Rockler failed almost immediately. I can't remember if they tested Holbren, but I bought MCLS bits based on their performance for the dollar. They have been great.

I think a lot of members get an assortment, then replace the heavily used bits with high-end ones when they wear out.

Eddy

[Holbren]

FWW did a test last year, where they used straight bits from a range of companies to cut dados in melamine shelving ( I think). They ranked the bits on chipping and tearout, also how many feet they could cut before failure.

There were huge differences, with Whiteside being at the top. They clearly outlasted the cheaper bits. Some of the familiar brands like Rockler failed almost immediately. I can't remember if they tested Holbren, but I bought MCLS bits based on their performance for the dollar. They have been great.

I think a lot of members get an assortment, then replace the heavily used bits with high-end ones when they wear out.

Eddy

Wasn't that FWW straight bit test from 1999? I believe Whiteside makes the best bit as shown in that test but running straight bits until they burn up isn't the best method. Anyone running a CNC will most likely use a spiral bit to help chip ejection and the solid carbide ones help with heat. Some of the newer spiral bits have a reduced hook angle too and Forest City (owned by Whiteside now) has the only duraline compression bit that the door guys love.

Anyway, they did test my bits in the latest review and I was happy with the results. What they didn't test was life and that is also where the better bits shine.

[TheRic]

When you have a router bit sharpened does it change the size of the bit? OR is this size so small it don't matter?

Where can I get them sharpened? Same place that sharpens saw blades?

How do I know the bits are getting dull? Any signs before it's too late?

[LCHIEN]

When you have a router bit sharpened does it change the size of the bit? OR is this size so small it don't matter?

Where can I get them sharpened? Same place that sharpens saw blades?

How do I know the bits are getting dull? Any signs before it's too late?

the grinding of the bit when sharpening is done on the face that's radial to the axis so the diameter does not change appreciably.

Yes, same place

Dull bits - harder to cut, more tear out less smooth. It's very gradual so in practice its really hard to tell.