Euro Cabinet Questions

[jackellis]

I'm about to start building cabinets for my new shop. All of the uppers will have shelves, and all of the lowers will have drawers. I'm planning on European style cabinets because I'm not ready to tackle face frame construction and I'm also not prepared to sacrifice storage space in the drawers. All cabinets will be mounted to the walls with French cleats. The uppers will have frame-and panel doors.

I need some advice on a couple of design details. First, with European hinges what is the smallest allowable width for door frames? Do I need 2 1/2 inches to accommodate the hinges or can I get away with 2 1/4"?

Second, the backs will be inset by 3/4" to accommodate the cabinet side of the French cleat, which will be attached at the top of the cabinet. I typically cut the backs a little loose so they don't force the joints apart. Are corner blocks in the bottoms of the boxes advisable in this case?

[JR]

If you want to take the guesswork out of this project, I can recommend Nahmy's plan for the Garage Workshop. It has exactly the features you are asking about - upper shelves, french cleats, lower drawers, bottom pullouts, euro cabinets, euro hinges.

The plan also includes a rolling cabinet, which has turned out to be my favorite part of the project. Even as my shop usage has evolved the rolling cabinet's versatility has made it mroe and more useful.

JR

[drumpriest]

Are you talking about the stile width? I've done 2" and it's been fine, any smaller than that and you are asking for trouble. If the doors are going to be large, I'll go 2-1/4 or 2-1/2.

[cabinetman]

Too narrow of a frame can be a visual issue. If you profile the outer perimeter, make sure you have the spacing for the cup placement and depth. You may need a very shallow cup, depending on the profile.

I do the back and cleat a little differently. Setting the back into groove making it captive, also makes it non replaceable. I would use a 1/4" plywood back. I rabbet the carcass 1/4" by 1 1/8" deep for the back. The back gets fastened to the rabbet. If cut to fit, the back will keep the cabinet square. I use a single cleat 3/4", and can be plywood or solid wood. I split a 6"-8" piece on a 45 degree rip, for the mating members.

The cabinet cleat gets installed behind the back and gets fastened to the carcass sides and top. The wall cleat gets fastened to the wall. With an 1 1/8" recess, the 45 degree angles will not bottom out when the cabinet is hung. Having that extra 1/8" recess will allow the cabinet to pull tightly to the wall, and allow back edge scribe if needed for any high wall spots.
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[jackellis]

Mike, thanks for suggesting rabbets instead of dadoes. That also solves the problem of either having to do a lot of hand work to clean up or living with an unsightly groove showing in the bottoms of the sides. I have air tools and I know how to use 'em!

I decided to bag the frame and panel doors for now. Even though ash would look spectacular, 24x24 doors would be really heavy, panels would have to be flattened by hand since I don't have a thickness sander, and I really don't have time to build them now. A plywood door will take 20 minutes to cut and dress around the edges, while an F&P door will probably take me two days (I work slow). I can always replace the doors when I have more time later.

[cabinetman]

A plywood door will take 20 minutes to cut and dress around the edges, while an F&P door will probably take me two days (I work slow). I can always replace the doors when I have more time later.

Since you'll probably edge the plywood, you could use 3/4" wide or wider of solid wood of any specie (that could be interesting), and miter the corners, and put on some nice looking profile. You might decide to leave them like that.
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[twistsol]

the Blum jig for 1/2" overlay cup hinges puts the inside edge of the cup hole 1.5" from the outer edge of the door. I've made doors with rails as stiles as narrow as 2" inches without issue. You might be able to go as narrow as 1.75" but I've never done it and wouldn't recommend it.

[RayintheUK]

As long as you have a couple of millimeters between the cup and the rear edge of the door, you'll be fine. The only restriction on the inside of the stile is how you're fixing it to the field material, otherwise the same rule applies.

There is virtually no side force or stress on the cup hole when operating the hinge, as proved by the tiny screws holding it in place. It's the overall tight fit that does the job and supports the weight, not the width of one part of the circumference. Try it on some scrap, you'll see what I mean.

Ray

[jackellis]

Since you'll probably edge the plywood, you could use 3/4" wide or wider of solid wood of any specie (that could be interesting), and miter the corners, and put on some nice looking profile. You might decide to leave them like that.

I just saw an example of some nice, simple frame-and-panel doors and *may* rethink them yet again. Trying to imagine what 1/2" BB panels would look like with ash frames. Or walnut, cherry or elm. That way, no flattening and less build time.

Decisions, decisions.