Veneer/Stain/End Grain

[avaserfi]

I am going to be laying and staining my first veneer job soon enough and got to thinking which lead to the realization of a problem:

There will be a couple portions where the veneer end grain will be visible. When doing my test samples to choose a proper stain I noticed that the end grain absorbs far more stain than the other portions making it much darker and stand out more. I was planning on laying the veneer to minimize end grain visibility, but there will still be some visible. Is there any way to make it so this matches stain wise or some technique I can use to allow for better matching?

Thanks

[LCHIEN]

guessing wildly here, maybe sizing it (e.g. using dilute glue) to seal the end grain?

[avaserfi]

guessing wildly here, maybe sizing it (e.g. using dilute glue) to seal the end grain?

If I sealed the end grain it wouldn't absorb any stain and still be a different color, just on the opposite end of the spectrum, wouldn't it?

[jlm]

I don't know how it would work with something as thin as veneer, but I've had good luck when staining end grain by sanding the end grain a couple levels "higher" than the face grain. Say you sand the faces with 220 grit paper, if you then sand the ends up to 400 or even 600, it will absorb less stain and end up about the same color. Of course, the results vary with wood species and so forth. How thick is the veneer you're going to using?

[avaserfi]

I am using red oak NBL.

Sounds like an idea worth a shot. I will be making one last test piece before going at it. I will try that on one of the sides.

[just started]

How are you going to hide the end grain of the substrate?

[cabinetman]

Sanding with a high grit may help some. Treating the edge (sizing) could leach (bleed) into the face. If its a veneer to veneer corner, and you feel creative, you could miter the joint.
.

[avaserfi]

How are you going to hide the end grain of the substrate?

I am going to be veneering these:



The plan is to veneer the top/bottom then the back and wrap one piece from one side to the front to the other side. This will cause the top/bottom front and side end grain to be hidden as well as the rear end grain to be hidden. The other portions will still show.

Sanding with a high grit may help some. Treating the edge (sizing) could leach (bleed) into the face. If its a veneer to veneer corner, and you feel creative, you could miter the joint.
.

Thanks. Another option to test. What do you mean by 'treating the edge (sizing)'?

Not sure I could do a miter joint I was planning on just flush trimming it with my router.


Just read on Wood Smith Shop that Gel stains are better for end grain. I have never used one before. Anyone have experience with such products?

[cabinetman]

Thanks. Another option to test. What do you mean by 'treating the edge (sizing)'?

Not sure I could do a miter joint I was planning on just flush trimming it with my router.

Sizing would consist of "sealing" to some degree, with either glue or sealer to prevent over saturation of stain. Just flush trimming and dressing the edge with a slight chamfer, or smoothing with a file, is what's usually done. I prefer to take excess veneer back with just a file.
.

[drumpriest]

As it's red oak, have you considered using a grain filler? I would suggest maybe trying it on a test piece. It usually allows for more even staining on Oak. Having said that, I have no practical experience really. I have stained oak veneer plywood, but whenever I am veneering my own substrates, it's to use something that I would not want to stain. But if you do some test pieces, you'll know what kind of trouble you are getting into.

[jabe]

I've never done this with veneer end grain but, I just coat the end grains of the wood with mineral oil b4 staining and it minimized the end grain from absorbing more stain. I do it just b4 staining, no waiting time involved.
Mineral oil/laxative, non toxic, cheap stuff and avaliable at any drug store. It might not be compatible with a water-base clear coat, try experimenting first on some scrap b4 finishing. No, your wood won't s--t on you. Hope this helps.

[pecker]

The veneer is about 1/32" thick. If you give the edges a light sanding with some fine sandpaper, then stain it, I doubt you'll see this dark line you're worrying about from any reasonable distance.

It will be about as visible as the edges of these:

[poolhound]

I can see from the photos that you have already finsihed the base construction but one way to solve this is to use a real hardwood edge/filler piece so there is never any veneer edge visible. It looks like the finished photos just posted may have done this.

That solution aside, I have used both techniques already suggested and they both work e.g. sanding and sealing. The results will vary from wood to wood.

The basic problem is that the end grain soaks up way more stain so the aim is to prevent this and balance it with the face grain. The sanding technique does work but I have never managed to get it perfectly balanced with the face, it simply reduces the effect.

Sealing would be the best option. As well as ideas already mentioned a sanding sealer or a light shellac coat would work. They dont seal it completly but simply fill some of the pores so the stain wont soak in as much. I know its a pain but the only way to get a perfect match is to setup some test pieces and treat with different sealers and # of coats & cuts and see which recipe works best.

As CABMAN pointed out with any sealing you will need to take care that it doesnt leach too much into the face. If you try this, mask the faces well, dont go mad with the sealing coats and lightly sand the faces afterwards.

You may also consider the option of "if you cant fix it -feature it." i.e if you think its always going to show figure how to incorporate this into your design and make it look intentional.