Thinking about redoing my kitchen cabinet doors

[wdreamsmaycome]

however I really don't want to redo the whole cabinets (which, albeit a bit ugly, are quite functional) which brings me to the question: how am I going to make the parts of the cabinets 'behind' the doors the same as the cabinet doors?

I was wondering about maybe laminating a very thin layer of similar wood and stain/finish it the same as the doors, but what would be other alternatives? Has anybody ever done anything like this? does it look ok?

[Warren]

I would suggest doing the face frame and the doors to insure a good match. Another suggestion would be figure out what wood makes up the face frames and use the same for the doors. Then, strip the face frame and stain the same as the new doors. You should be able to get a decent match.

[Jan]

Rockler and HD both sell kits for laminating cabinets with wood veneers. HD sells a not particularly good video on the process.

[wdreamsmaycome]

I would suggest doing the face frame and the doors to insure a good match. Another suggestion would be figure out what wood makes up the face frames and use the same for the doors. Then, strip the face frame and stain the same as the new doors. You should be able to get a decent match.

the cabinets don't seem to have a face frame at all, when the doors are closed they are basically one contiguous surface, and when opening them you can see that the cabinet is made just of 'sides', there isn't really a 'front' to speak of.

I could try to do the new doors the same way (getting them super close to each other), but I think it would still look better if the 'front' of the cabinet box matched (at least approximately) the wood stain/finish of the new doors.

[Popeye]

Having "frameless" cabinets I'd just go the thin wood laminate route. The end panels can be done with the same material. Pat

[crokett]

Having frameless cabinets, why limit yourself? I'd investigate putting frames on them if it will work from a functional perspective. That way you can get the new doors and face frames to exactly match.

[whitecobra]

We are just about to complete that exact project
We removed the old doors made solid Ash doors with raised moldings and then bought Ash Veneer in LARGE sheets and cut it to strips and applied it as needed
Rehang the doors and you are done
Just because you HAVE a frame-less cabinet doesn't mean you must KEEP them
I agree with David I would build frames attach them and then give yourself the freedom to use overlay or partial overlay door designs as well as the ability to mask the old cabinets with wood veneer
All in all the hardest part is producing the doors and drawer fronts the rest anyone can do
We had 31 doors and 12 drawers to produce PLUS I made new actual drawer boxes so it was a big project
We left the old wood look on the inside.

Dr D

[wdreamsmaycome]

thanks for the tips.

If I built frames how would I go in terms of the door hardware? The added thickness would likely mean I'd have to either get new ones or drill new holes in the old cabinets? (current hardware is I think what's called 'european' hinges, the ones with the round hole in which the hinge goes, and the hinge has a few screws to adjust it)

How did you mount the frames to the previous cabinets? Just nailed it and then venereed it? or did you do something different?

[crokett]

wdreams - send a PM to username stan to look over this thread. He just finished building his kitchen cabinets and more than likely can answer a lot of the questions.

As far as attaching the face frames mine are nailed with finish nails. But then I also have painted cabinets. From my experience with cabinets the HW is dependent on the design but with the addition of face frames you most likely would need new HW, yes.

[wdreamsmaycome]

thanks for the tip, I PM'd Stan and we'll see if he'll chime in.

As of now my plan is to redo the doors the same dimensions of the current ones (of course in a different style, this is what I'm going to try to achieve (although this particular one is framed vs frameless)



and to do the edges of the frameless cabinets with some press/glue-on veneer. I'm not sure if it'll be possible to get actual wood veneer that I can stain/finish to match exactly my cabinet doors, although given that the cabinets are frameless possibly even if the match isn't exact it could be ok (as you can't see the edges at all with the doors closed).

I am also planning to create panels for my fridge door and for the outside of the island, hopefully it won't be too difficult or cause issues (esp. for the fridge door, which I'm not sure is engineered to support panels)

[mschrank]

I'll offer a different suggestion than those above...just to confound you even more

If it were me, I'd stick with the frameless design. Makes it easier if you want to add things like pull-out shelves and such (with face frame, you would have to decrease the width of pullouts.

Also, adding a face frame might mean you have to build new drawer boxes because of the decreased width. Once you're to the point of building face frames, new doors/drawer fronts, AND new drawers, why not start from scratch? Plus, you would have to get new hardware as you pointed out (btw, they do make "european" style hinges for face frames. These hinges are great in their adjustability)

I say keep it simple. Stick with frameless, settle on a door design and get some iron-on edge banding of the same wood which you can stain/finish to match.

The links I included are what Rockler offers, but there's lots of other vendors that might me cheaper.

[wdreamsmaycome]

hey Mike, thanks for the link, btw is that thing in the picture actually a miniature iron? lol...

My only concern with veneering (iron/glue/...) is that I worry that the grain of the wood might look strange (being always parallel to the long side of the frame), or maybe it's not as noticeable on this type of product?

[crokett]

Well... as far as staining a veneer goes, you can always rip whatever kind of wood you use for the drawers to 1/16" or 1/8" thick strips and use that as your veneer. Then stain it to match the drawers and you have an exact match.

[whitecobra]

I think I missed something here
The photo is NOT of framed cabinets it is of frame less
The doors go right to each other
European hinges can be used on framed or frame less and on offset or inset doors
Blum makes them to fit every conceivable combination
As for edging the doors why are you looking for veneer? Are you not going to REMAKE the doors?
If you do you are most likely going to use hardwood so edge veneer is not needed
As for the frame less cabinets how much are you really going to show based on the photo you posted?
All you need to veneer is the wood between carcasses and then the end panels which you can EASILY make a "door" to fit over or as I said use sheet veneer
Maybe I need some help in understanding what you WANT to do in order to help you get there
Thought I was there when I first posted but I think I just confused you more
Help me to help you
If you are doing purely frame less cabinets then there almost NO need to alter the existing boxes just make new doors. If you are going to make frames (which you can make in 3/8" if you really want to) then that is a whole different deal and by the shear construction of them you eliminate the issue
Dr D

[Stan]

wdreamsmaycome,

First of all, if you have a couple pictures of your existing cabinets that would sure be handy.

I have only done a couple re-facing jobs (which were both face-framed, but a lot will be similiar) and there are a couple items to add to the mix here.

Are the cabinets painted? And if so, about how old might the oldest layer of paint be? (If it is likely to be of the lead-based paint era -- be sure to wear appropriate breathing protection should you sand the paint off).

I'm not sure about adding face-frames, you would have to resize all doors and drawers going that route (which ain't all that big of a deal), but be sure to check all clearances as adding a 3/4" thick face frame to the front of existing frameless cabinets would bring you out 3/4" beyond 'standard' cabinet depth. (i.e. in an "L" corner with doors on one side of the "L" and drawers on the other side -- the drawers may no longer be able to open due to hitting the door...)

If you do add face-frames, take a look at the Blum Compact-33 hinges, you can then buy mounting plates with whatever overlay would look best. If you add a 1-1/2" face frame, 1-3/8" overlay plates should get you close to your existing reveal depending on the current reveal.

As far as re-facing goes. We use a 10-mil paper backed wood veneer which is applied using laminate adhesive. (I did a quick google on "10 mil veneer" -- this is the first link that came up for reference).

We use the iron on edgebanding for shelving, but I've never done that on frameless cabinet fronts -- don't see why it wouldn't work though.

Just a little insight to my take on refacing cabinets after doing a couple (keep in mind, both of these were face-framed kitchens).

The sanding involved was extensive (1-1/2 to 2 days of sanding) which must be done to ensure you have a good clean surface for the adhesive to bond with. Then another 1-1/2 to 2 days cutting veneer and gluing in place, fitting butt seams is a real joy Having an old paper cutter handy to cut square ends is real handy. And remember -- "putty is yer buddy".

Veneers seem to show slightly lighter color when stained compared to 'real' wood. (Don't know if it was just the oak veneer we were using, or if this is typical).

If it were me personally -- I would build new carcasses and do a complete install, that's not a suggestion -- just an observation.

Hope this helps one way or t'other.