Can I do this. Electrical experts help please!

[dbhost]

I know from my discussion with an electrician friend of mine, that local code requires pigtails in the boxes except for the last box in the circuit.

I am running 2 new outlet boxes, removing 1 ceiling light and box, and adding a new one. (Getting rid of the single bulb fixture in the garage and installing one in the attic so I can see what the dickens is up there without dragging a flashlight up every time...

I am using all plastic boxes,

The problem comes with the light fixture, no ground. Every diagram I see shows metal boxes and conduit, with the ground from the wire grounded to the metal box.

I THINK but I am not certain that where the two runs of 12/2 w/ground meet in the box, I can pigtail the hot and neutral wires together with the lamp fixture, and simply wire nut the grounds together. Does that sound about right?

[Chris_B]

Yes.

AFAIK, the whole idea behind pigtails is to prevent ridiculous (and unsafe) monster connections for the through junctions. In this case, adding pigtails would make the connections (marginally) less reliable because you would have three extra nuts in the box.

[dbhost]

Yes.

AFAIK, the whole idea behind pigtails is to prevent ridiculous (and unsafe) monster connections for the through junctions. In this case, adding pigtails would make the connections (marginally) less reliable because you would have three extra nuts in the box.

Agreed, but according to the electricians I have talked to, they are code here. My biggest concern was dealing with the ground. I have been painfully careful with the pigtails... Certainly not in love with them...

[newbie2wood]

"I THINK but I am not certain that where the two runs of 12/2 w/ground meet in the box, I can pigtail the hot and neutral wires together with the lamp fixture, and simply wire nut the grounds together. Does that sound about right?"

This will work but normally only one 12/2 is run to the box for a lamp fixture. Two 12/2 are run to the switch box. If you are refering to the run from the switch box to the lamp box as a "pigtail" then you are fine. For me, a pigtail is a short piece of wire within a box.
________
Laguna Bay II Condo

[dbhost]

Sorry about the lameness of the Paint diagram, I knocked this out as quickly as I could, didn't worry about pretty...

Does this make sense as to what I am talking about?

[LarryG]

In a receptacle box, the pigtails ensure continuity for the remainder of the circuit should one receptacle fail. At a light fixture where the circuit continues on to another light, the pigtails aren't needed since the leads from the fixture serve the same purpose.

However, looking at what you have drawn there, your fixture looks like it will be hot all the time, unless it has its own switch (pull chain or similar). If one of the black wire leads to a wall switch and there are outlets "downstream" of the light, they will be switched as well. (I think. Need to see a diagram of the entire circuit, to be certain.)

[Rand]

That will work. You realize that the new boxes will both be controlled by the same switch right?

Around here you are not allowed to use a wire nut on the ground wires. You have to use a copper crimp ring. You crimp the grounds together and leave one of them long - a pigtail - in case you need to modify the circuit later.

Here's a crimp tool:
http://www.amazon.com/Channellock-CH.../dp/B00166RZVY

[dbhost]

In a receptacle box, the pigtails ensure continuity for the remainder of the circuit should one receptacle fail. At a light fixture where the circuit continues on to another light, the pigtails aren't needed since the leads from the fixture serve the same purpose.

However, looking at what you have drawn there, your fixture looks like it will be hot all the time, unless it has its own switch (pull chain or similar). If one of the black wire leads to a wall switch and there are outlets "downstream" of the light, they will be switched as well. (I think. Need to see a diagram of the entire circuit, to be certain.)

You are right, the entire circuit is switched, and this fixture is switched, it's one of those cheap round ceramic bare bulb fixtures you see in closets and attics... This is going in my attic... All of the outlets on the circuit are switched. The idea here is this fixture can only be energized when the main wall switch is turned on as well... The other outlets are providing power to the shop light fixtures in the garage...

[dbhost]

That will work. You realize that the new boxes will both be controlled by the same switch right?

Around here you are not allowed to use a wire nut on the ground wires. You have to use a copper crimp ring. You crimp the grounds together and leave one of them long - a pigtail - in case you need to modify the circuit later.

Here's a crimp tool:
http://www.amazon.com/Channellock-CH.../dp/B00166RZVY

Nope, wire nuts are code here...

Yeah I understand the new boxes will be controlled by the wall switch, that is what I want. I do not want the pull chain switch to impact the rest of the circuit though... And I don't think it should by pigtailing...

[newbie2wood]

"The problem comes with the light fixture, no ground. Every diagram I see shows metal boxes and conduit, with the ground from the wire grounded to the metal box."

A ground wire is not needed if you are using a plastic box and ceramic fixture.

The wiring, as drawn, will work. However, if you are splicing into an existing wire in the attic, unless there is sufficent slack in the wire, you will need to add another box to the circuit to make the connections.
________
CandyDirty

[LarryG]

Okay, if that's what you want, you're good to go. A light fixture that has the leads hard-wired into it (the typical bedroom or bathroom ceiling fixture) doesn't need pigtails because the included leads are, in effect, pigtails.

But in your case you will run pigtails to the terminal screws on the porcelain socket, because it won't have any leads hard-wired in. The pull chain will control the light; the circuit will continue on to the outlets as if the light fixture isn't even there; if the bulb blows or the pull switch fails the outlets won't be affected.

The wall switch will control the whole works, assuming it is between (electrically) the panel and the light and outlets. Which means you will first have to turn on the wall switch in order to energize the pull chain switch -- but I think you realize that.

[dbhost]

Okay, if that's what you want, you're good to go. A light fixture that has the leads hard-wired into it (the typical bedroom or bathroom ceiling fixture) doesn't need pigtails because the included leads are, in effect, pigtails.

But in your case you will run pigtails to the terminal screws on the porcelain socket, because it won't have any leads hard-wired in. The pull chain will control the light; the circuit will continue on to the outlets as if the light fixture isn't even there; if the bulb blows or the pull switch fails the outlets won't be affected.

The wall switch will control the whole works, assuming it is between (electrically) the panel and the light and outlets. Which means you will first have to turn on the wall switch in order to energize the pull chain switch -- but I think you realize that.

Bingo...

Mind you, this replaces a pre-existing light fixture (basic single bulb cheapie) and an outlet box that was ABOVE the drywall (no clue why) that the old garage door opener was installed in The original owner had the whole thing wired up to run off the switch so the opener wouldn't work when they were away... Useful huh?

[crokett]

The code differences are interesting. Here, you don't need to pigtail outlets when continuing a run to the next box. My inspectors allow crimps but would rather see wire nuts than crimps for non-professional electricians. I asked why and the inspector said crimps are easier to mess up without the right tool/knowledge. He saw my crimped connections during the inspection and wanted to see the crimpers. I prefer crimps for splices because they take up less room in the box. For fixtures I do wire nuts.

[LarryG]

The code differences are interesting.

They can be, yes. People who don't deal with codes all the time often don't realize that when a municipality adopts a national code, the local building official has the discretion to waive certain requirements or to be more stringent than the code calls for on others.

I don't think, strictly speaking, that pigtails are required here, although a lot of the local electricians use them. That's one of several things I need to confirm before I start wiring my proposed new shop.

[Jerry P.]

[QUOTE=newbie2wood;448820]"This will work but normally only one 12/2 is run to the box for a lamp fixture. Two 12/2 are run to the switch box./QUOTE]


Not always the case! Sometimes power is run to the ceiling box from a receptacle, and 1 romex is run from the ceiling box to the switch.
This wiring configuration means that there could still be "live" wires in the ceiling box even though the switch is off! Be careful ! Check for power before working. See attached diagrams:

Jerry P.