Is Popler or Aspen poor for furinture?

[lcm1947]

I have seen furiture built from yellow pine at lot but never these two woods. Is there a reason? Surely pine is about the cheapest wood in the world so you'd think these two woods would be better to use then Pine but it seems not. Is that correct?

[Jeffrey Schronce]

You can edit titles by hitting the "advanced" button when in edit mode.

Poplar is used in a lot of cabinet and furniture making on areas that are not exposed. Poplar is a pretty soft hardwood. It also can have some pretty random and odd coloring. It can also be very plain looking. Pine has a little more character. The up shot with poplar is that it is pretty stable, machines very well and is overall decent to work with.

Pine is usually used on "country" style furniture where you are looking for rustic look, knots, etc.

Don't know about Aspen. Don't see it around here.

[lcm1947]

Oh thanks Jeffrey about changing the title. Excellent! That just pleased me all get out. I can see not using it because it's kind of plain. So it's softer then Pine then? I have tried the finger nail test and they actually seem about the same to me but it was just the finger nail test. Maybe not a really good test like bumps or things falling on it would be. And you are right I have seen some pretty neat looking patterns too but I bet you couldn't find enough to build a whole piece of furiture with though. Probably 98 % of what I've seen is pretty darn plain. That's true.

[Pappy]

Poplar works good for pieces that are going to be painted. It can be stained but still is somewhat plain looking.

Aspen is similar but is softer and doesn't machine as well.

[Jeffrey Schronce]

So it's softer then Pine then? I have tried the finger nail test and they actually seem about the same to me but it was just the finger nail test.

They are very close. Hardness is measured by Janka scale. Google Janka and you can find info. Poplar and Pine are pretty darn soft. If you are looking for inexpensive, hard, plain wood Ash is nice.

[LCHIEN]

there are woods that are soft and woods that are hard and then there are woods the are hardwoods and softwoods. The softwoods are basically pine. Most everything else is officially classified as hardwoods.
Hardwoods come in a range of hardness from fairly soft to hard. Softwoods are generally pretty soft.

Now, while pine is soft, oak is hard. poplar is in between. Poplar machines nicely but it shortcoming is the color (usually kind of greenish-purple-grey hues), not considered real pretty and the fact that it doesn't take stain very well. If you are going to paint then poplar is OK.

Pine is used for its rustic look in furniture and cabinets - lots of knots.

Aspen I don't see used much but I think its an OK hardwood, used mostly in the northern US where its abundant.

[drumpriest]

I am going to somewhat disagree with these fine folks. Quite frankly, you should ignore all of us and use poplar or aspen if you'd like. Who the heck are we to say whether or not poplar is "ok"???

I have used poplar as a primary wood for a couple of projects. You can find some really interesting heartwood poplar if you look for it. Greens, purples, all get mixed together, some dark browns, some lighter tones, in the heart wood.

Poplar is far softer than most of the woods that are commonly used for furniture making, but really nice to work.

As to popularity.... a recent study showed that the most influential element in whether or not a person likes a piece of music is if they have heard it before. I find this mentality extends to most things. Don't let the fact that others don't do something be the sole reason for you not doing it.

[gwyneth]

The softwoods are basically pine. Most everything else is officially classified as hardwoods.
Hardwoods come in a range of hardness from fairly soft to hard. Softwoods are generally pretty soft.

For anyone who needs an easy way to remember: needles = softwood, leaves = hardwood. Or if you've ever bought or gathered firewood: stuff that burns really fast is almost always softwood. Stuff that burns really slow is almost always hardwood.

Southern yellow pine and some subspecies of Douglas fir are about the hardest softwoods.

For most woodworkers, buying Bruce Hoadley's "Understanding Wood" will pay for itself many times over in savings of money and time. Lots of useful charts about density, etc.

[LCHIEN]

...
As to popularity.... a recent study showed that the most influential element in whether or not a person likes a piece of music is if they have heard it before. I find this mentality extends to most things. Don't let the fact that others don't do something be the sole reason for you not doing it.

so play it once , I may hate it.
Play it again, I'll like it better?

[LCHIEN]

For anyone who needs an easy way to remember: needles = softwood, leaves = hardwood. Or if you've ever bought or gathered firewood: stuff that burns really fast is almost always softwood. Stuff that burns really slow is almost always hardwood.

...

That's correct, but I hardly ever see wood with any kind of leaves or needles still attached to help in identification in the lumber section of Lowes. They don't like you to set fire to the wood in the aisles either. I just have to remember, any pines and firs are softwoods, everything else is officially a hardwood.

To answer the OPs (Mac's) question, you can build furniture out of anything you want. Including poplar, pine or Aspen. Just be aware of the properties.

[drumpriest]

Yep Loring, those were the findings. I didn't do the study, but I find it plausable. A lot of people don't go to the trouble of researching what they buy, music or otherwise. Simple repeatable hooks, and repeated exposure those are keys to success in the music industry. It's not that if you hate something, you will suddenly change your mind, it's more about the things to which you are nuetral. Familiarity endears the tune to the listener, it becomes comfortable.

But more importantly, the point I was making...don't make furniture out of oak because that's what people do. Make it out of oak because you really like the astetics of oak, or you really just enjoy working with oak, or whatever material.

[Popeye]

I've used alot of poplar, stained and painted. Pick the correct pieces and you get a very nice, clear and easy to work wood. When staining it use a conditioner to help keep down blotching. I've used it for face frames with birch plywood and all by itself for small tables and such.
IMO not every wood that is fit for furniture needs to be rock hard, be exotic, have some great grain pattern, or hurt your wallet to be a good furniture wood. Of course I'm the type that likes knotty pine, looks for knots and odd grain patterns and weird color streaks to make a focal point on pieces.
Try it and see how you like it. Pat

[cabinetman]

I am going to somewhat disagree with these fine folks. Quite frankly, you should ignore all of us and use poplar or aspen if you'd like. Who the heck are we to say whether or not poplar is "ok"???

I have used poplar as a primary wood for a couple of projects. You can find some really interesting heartwood poplar if you look for it. Greens, purples, all get mixed together, some dark browns, some lighter tones, in the heart wood.

Poplar is far softer than most of the woods that are commonly used for furniture making, but really nice to work.

As to popularity.... a recent study showed that the most influential element in whether or not a person likes a piece of music is if they have heard it before. I find this mentality extends to most things. Don't let the fact that others don't do something be the sole reason for you not doing it.

An excellent response. Don't get swayed by what you hear. In using Poplar or Aspen, if you have the chance to browse the stockpile you can find some interesting pieces.

Poplar is easier to find at hardwood suppliers in thicker stock. A lot of it is used in the industry as structural skeletons in upholstered chairs and sofas. As for stress strength in pounds per sq. inch (PSI) for wet/dry tests, Poplar is slightly less than Aspen. The uniformity and grain density in Poplar makes for easy machining.

As for Douglas Fir, the bending PSI wet/dry is greater than Red Maple.

As for Pine, the variety of Slash Pine, (Longleaf Pine, Florida Pine, Dade County Pine) and Southern Yellow Pine exceed the PSI for stress in bending, and parallel to the grain compression wet/dry over both Oak and Maple.

If you've ever worked with some of the variety of pines you'll notice a big difference in hardness and weight over the White Pine you find at the BORG.

[SARGE..g-47]

I'll join Popeye on using poplar. Some consider it framing or painting wood.. but at one time oak was considered junk wood also. Anything made with other than mahogany.. walnut and cherry were considered cheap stuff.

You have to do some searching to find it clear and without the purplish streaks. Or.. I have built some things that I purposely chose heavy amounts of the purplish tint looking for effect. And poplar will splotch when staining if not handled correctly... but so will cherry and pine and that doesn't stop me from using it when the appropriate need arises.

And I will agree with Cabinetman that simply thinking pine is just pine, you would be making a mistake. Pick up a piece of southern yellow pine in one hand and a piece of white pine in another. You will find one is much.. much denser. And as far as hardness.. that same denser southern yellow pine is much harder than the white pine.

As someone suggested... purchasing a copy of Hoadley's "Understanding Wood" might not be a bad investment. You will step up a rung on the ladder when you understand the properties of various wood and use that knowledge in helping to make a selection of what is best for a given task.

Regards...

[lcm1947]

Well I certainly appreciate all the replies. I have a better understanding now then I did that's for sure. I think I will buy that book however as it probably would provide me an even better understanding. Not to mention probably interesting since I'm really enjoying this hobby and it seems all I'm interested in anymore is woodworking. Not building much but sure seem to be buying tools and stuff a lot. God I love tools! Anyway thanks again and I think I will try using both these woods on some small stuff just to see for myself. Oh thanks Jeffrey for telling me about the Janka scale. Interesting. So now I have a third wood to try - Ash. Either the local HD or Lowes sells it so should be able to get my hands on some easy enough. I didn't realize how hard it was. Weird that people don't use that more.