Is faster better?

[twistsol]

We are building a shed to park the snowblower, lawnmowers etc., and I needed to get permission from the HOA, a zoning review, and a building permit for an 8*12 shed. We moved from the country to the suburbs and while the process is much faster in civilization, I don't think it is more civilized and you don't get to drink bad coffee with friends and neighbors..

Country Process	Suburban Process
Get your plans together	Get your plans together
Send an email to Cheryl to get on the planning board schedule.	Email your plans to the HOA
Cheryl calls back and you chat for half an hour about family etc. and you get put on the schedule for next month, because the first Tuesday of this month has already passed. (The schedule hasn't changed in my lifetime.)	Get HOA Approval in a couple of days.
Go to the Township Planning meeting. with 10 copies of everything so the board members all have a copy and the neighbors have some to chat about. Chat with Bob (wife's uncle and board chair) Talk about the barn that blew down on his son's farm last year and complain about how the state is holding up the removal process because there might be lead paint in it somewhere. Chat with other neighbors. get opinions on who should/shouldn't do the concrete work, and drink 8 cups of weak coffee. The meeting lasts 3 hours and we're still talking about the salt shed, replacing the road grader but we think it will last another summer, and eventually present your plans which are approved. Open mail and bills for the township, chat and drink more coffee.	Fill out the city paperwork online
Go to the full township board meeting the following Tuesday and repeat last Tuesday's discussions and add in tales of the extraordinary measures you took to keep your livestock cool when the power was out for three days. Drink more coffee. Get township approval and pay small fee.
On Wednesday take a long lunch to drive to the county courthouse, 35 miles each way with your plans, township approval, township receipt and your paperwork for the county filled out.
Stop in at the tax office where they verify your address, zoning code, and parcel number, and that property taxes are current.
Submit all paperwork to the county planning office. Go out of your way on the way home and grab a burger at King's. it only adds 10 miles to the trip.
Two to three weeks later, your building permit approval comes in the mail with bill for the permit.	Receive zoning and plan approval two days later with a link to pay the permit fee.
Mail a check to the county (drive it there if you're in a hurry)	Pay fee online and print out the permit.
The permit comes in the mail in a week or two.
Total Time 2-4 Months	Total Time 4-5 Days

[leehljp]

Our city water/utility finally started accepting autopay through bankdrafts this month! its a good thing because I never paid two consecutive months - since I had to take it to the city office 3 blocks from me. SO I let it accrue and paid every other month. One fellow said something to me about that and I said I will pay it forward, so I paid two months that I owed and two months in advance. They didn't like that either. The past mayor and the current mayor were school mates of mine and we get along well. Small towns have a life of their own!

BTW, My PO Box is one number different from the city office and I got their mail surprisingly often. That is why they don't give me a hard time. I hand deliver to the city office door.

[cwsmith]

After living in a small village/factory town for thirty years we moved back to the medium-sized city that we had grown up in. Mostly to be close to family again. Things I liked and disliked about both.

In the village, you simply went down to the town hall which was just located in fire department building at the bottom of our hill, less than a quarter mile away. You parked on the street in front of the office (no parking meter or anything). You knew the clerk by her first name and asked how the family was, and what you needed in order to build the new deck, etc. She'd look it up in the zoning book and tell me whether I needed a permit or have to meet with the board at their next monthly meeting. I'd take a couple of pictures and a sketch with dimensions. A day or so later I might get a phone call and my village trustee would stop by and take a look, followed by an okay and was told to stop the village office and the clerk would give me the permit to post and pay the small fee.

Here in the city, when I wanted to place an Amish-built shed (12 x 20). The limit here in the city was a maximum of 12 x 16 and I had to apply for an exception. I had to drive down to city hall, circle the block a few times until I spotted a parking space, feed the meter, and then walk the two blocks back to the city office building. Then go through their security system (metal detector, empty your pockets, have your brief case or folder searched, and then you'd be given a pass. Take the elevator up three floors, go through a receptionist, who'd direct me down a long hallway to another office where I'd wait for one of the city zoning or building officers.

He'd make out some papers and tell me I'd have to wait for someone to call me. In the meantime, you need to go to any neighbor within 300 feet of your property, tell them what you want to do, and have them sign a permission list that they had no objections to your building or your intended purpose for it's use.

I then had to supply a satelite picture (thankyou to Google maps) of my property and show exactly where I would place the building. Another trip down to the city office building, security, etc. and I dropped everything off. A few days later I was told that I'd have to meet with the City Council Board and make a presentation at their monthly council meeting in two weeks at 7:00 pm.

So, we go there and the place is packed. It's like a small amphitheater with the council at a large table facing rising rolls of seats for spectators and people like me who have business to conduct.

First project on the night's agenda was a team of executives, with their engineers and legal council who want to rennovate some office building; that was followed by another team of engineers and lawyers who want to tear down an old building and build a medical office; then a guy with his lawyer and marketing person who were planning a new shopping area. All multi-million dollar projects!

And then there was me! Just Charlie... good thing I'm comfortable speaking to audiences (thanks to Toastmasters and a few decades making presentations to company executives). I didn't know I was going to have to make a visual presentation, but thankfully the city clerk who I had given my paperwork to, had a projector that could display that on their large sceen. So I started off with my Google property satellite, then a picture of my shed in the Almish advertising flyer, and then I told them it was going to cost $4.8 Million... oops, I'm sorry, I mean $4,800 dollars! That got a few laughs. (I thought it was ridculous to be lumped in with those far larger and more importantant commercial property programs.

One of the councilmen asked why I couldn't keep to the code limit of 14 ft long and I explained that a typical piece of lumber was 8 ft long and if I was going to pass that through my table saw, I'd need a minimum of 8 ft on both the infeed and outfeed side, plus room for the saw! Otherwise I'd have to take it out into the driveway or yard. He whispered something to the members on either side of him and then told me they'd have to vote on it.

A week later I got my permit. And a week after delivery, the City Code inspector showed up to verify my location and that the building was exactly as described. He wanted to know what kind of macinery I was going to use and that I needed an electrical permit. (I had done that the day after delivery). A couple of weeks later I had the city electrical inspector show up to see if I passed code.

This whole thing was almost two months and three visits from city inspectors. In the village, it was a less than a week for my 14 x 25 deck which I built myself and it required only one visit from my neighborhood trustee, with no problem from any of my neighbors except to comeover and compliment my building skill. In the city I had one old guy who owned the rental near me, complain that my shed would degrade the neighborhood. Fortunately, the city ignored his objection.

Things were just so much easier in the Village. The only drawback with that would have been if the village told you "no" that would have would have pretty much the end of it.

CWS