Snow chain recommendations

[jussi]

Living in Southern California I've never really had need for snow chains. So I don't have any experience with them. I'll be heading for a long weekend trip next month to do some snowboarding and was wondering if any of you guys that live in the colder climates have any recommendations for snow chains. Any details I should be looking for? Thanks

[woodturner]

Living in Southern California I've never really had need for snow chains. So I don't have any experience with them. I'll be heading for a long weekend trip next month to do some snowboarding and was wondering if any of you guys that live in the colder climates have any recommendations for snow chains. Any details I should be looking for? Thanks

The cable type chains are easier on the tires and install a little easier.

Practice installing the chains on a nice warm day - so when you are stuck by the side of the road in a blizzard, you already know the "tricks" to installing them.

It's best to use four chains, one on each tire, rather than just two chains on the driving wheels.

Don't drive faster than 30 mph with chains, and drive ONLY on deeper snow with chains. If there is not enough snow to fully embed the chains, they tend to damage the tires.

If you are not used to driving in the snow and don't plan to do this more than once or twice, you will likely be better off to hitch a ride with a friend, buy a ski vacation package that includes transportation, etc. If you are not experienced in driving in the snow, you are likely to have an accident. Chains will give you a little more traction in the snow, but the car will still slip and slide and skid around.

[dbhost]

It's been a very long time, but as I recall, chains were a disasterous idea when I dealt with them last.

I don't have them for my current truck, but I used to drive to Oregon a LOT in winter, and had a set of studded tires on spare rims that I would carry with me. When the snow started flying, I would pull into a tire shop / garage somewhere and have them swap rims / tires for me. Usually about $20.00

On that truck I typically ran 33x12.50/16 LTs during the summer, winter / snows were 275/70/R16s (approx 23x11.0) so that the studs won't have clearance problems. Typically if you run an oversize tire, you want to bump down one size for studs or chains. Adjust the speedo accordingly...

[Black wallnut]

Cable chains are fine. Yup practice before you have to use them. The great thing about cable chains is your top speed can be higher and they are fine on ice contrary to what is above. For my Yukon I have just one set plus one spare that I found when out hunting. I always chain just the back. Studs are nice for ice and hard compact but are a poor substitute for deeper snow when you need chains. Formerly I drove for a living and have lots of experience chaining.

Best advice is avoid driving in it if you can. Often waiting just a few hours will allow the roads to be cleaned up. I live in snow country and do not own any two wheel drive cars, haven't for years. ON bad roads it goes from a nice drive to dead in micro-seconds. Slow down but if you are too scared to drive at a moderate speed you create a hazard by driving too slowly or can lack required momemtum to carry you through supered corners.

[greenacres2]

For a single weekend, one time only in the snow--i'm thinking a 4 day rental of an SUV might compete financially with the purchase and proper installation of chains (it becomes a "no-brainer" if there was an incident between chains and fenders!!). Remember, most resorts rely on customers getting to them, so they will do what they can to keep the place accessible.

We live off the southern tip of Lake Michigan so we get lake-effect snows of up to 24" or more on kind of a regular basis. For LOML's Scion xB (front wheel drive) we just run a decent all-season tire--currently Bridgestone Turzana's if i recall correctly. On my MB C-230 sports coupe (rear wheel drive) i swap to winter tires (this car likes Dunlop Wintersports) each November and back to Goodyear Triple Treads in early March. I usually don't have a problem getting to our fire station to pick up a truck or medic rig.

Front wheel drive helps, but if you're running a dry or summer tire you'll have some issues even on snow too light for chains or studs. If you're running a factory-equipped tire that's not been hot too much--you might be in better shape than you think.

earl

[Bill in Buena Park]

Jussi,
When I was going up to the local mountains regularly I used (and still have) these diamond-pattern chains for my Bronco, all four tires: http://www.jcwhitney.com/diamond-pat.../p2009532.jcwx

They were an investment, but worth it, especially in 4W drive. Not sure what you're driving, but in my experience, cables work better with cars than heavier vehicles. Also, cables or chains, you still risk breaking free on water ice (I've had the Bronco "skate" on road ice atop my chains a time or two), so watch for changes between snow and ice.

[durango dude]

My 4Runner has all terrain BFGs on it ---

I don't generally mess with chains. Between the great tires and the great vehicle, I don't usually find myself needing anything else.

I used to have a 2WD Suburban, and kept a set of cable tire chains in the back ---- which I needed 2-3 times.

I have a simple rule......

If the roads are bad ---- I generally don't go out.

[tommyt654]

We rarely get any significant snows here in the south, except for maybe 93 I think when we got 10 inches in 1 night, so we never have the need, but I am really from up north and have relatives all up the eastern seaboard, Make a long story shorter in 1982 they had what many here called the great snow jam, folks were stuck on I-285 for 8-10 hours for about 2 inches of snow. I recall seeing a guy get out and put snow chains on the rear of his front wheel drive car and I laughed all the way home as I had a 6 banger F-100 loaded to the gills with equipment and 10 bales of wet frozen pine straw that allowed me to go places the idiots here that can't drive could not go in their 4wd's, Brake early and lightly and the same for acceleration and you'll be fine. It everyone else you need to look out for unless your in snow coutry, most of those folks know how to drive in it,be safe

[atgcpaul]

Used to live in SoCal myself. Bought a set of cable chains when we moved back East. Got them from tirechain.com. $50 for the chain but $13 for the shipping. They have come in handy on a trip to Maine in January but it was less the snow that I was worried about than the lack of visibility. Not going to pretend I have nearly the same level of experience as any of these guys with chains or snow, but the difference was noticeable in my 2wd sport wagon with and without chains. I had no wild twist and turns or hairy ledges like you'll get out there so much less for me to worry about. Your situation may be different.

Used cable chains once before in Yosemite in March with my parents couple years ago. We rented a 4x4 but also rented the chains. We came across a spun out sedan that was right next to the rock wall next to the cliff. My dad and I are digging this guy out when a box truck rounds the corner a little too fast and slams on the brakes. I don't remember my life flashing in front of my eyes but it was one of those slo-mo moments as I envisioned this truck crashing into me, my dad, this car, and all of us flying off this cliff while my wife, mom, and sister watched from our car. There was enough time to get some choice words in, though. Anyway, he was able to swerve into the ditch and not tip over and was able to drive out on his own.

[JimD]

I live in the south now but drove in snow country over 30 years and have never used chains. I've driven in 12 inch deep snow, with a 4 wheel drive SUV, with all season tires, no chains. I've used snow tires and studded snow tires and they are a little better. But if you know what you are doing, avoid driving right after a significant snowfall, and have decent all season tires on the vehicle you should be fine. A bag of sand in the trunk for rear wheel drive is also a decent idea. The weight helps some and the sand can be real handy if you find a small patch of ice you need to get out of.

Jim

[dbhost]

... Studs are nice for ice and hard compact but are a poor substitute for deeper snow when you need chains.

That's why you use studded M&S rated tires, preferrably inexpensive ones as good M&S rated tires get spendy REALLY fast...

On my old truck I used Maxxis Buckshot Mudders that were studded, I think I originally got them @ Les Schwab in Corvallis Oregon.

A good high void tire with self cleaning characteristics is what you want with deep snow, however MANY true mud tires have a rubber compound that turns rock hard when temps dip, and lose their ability to self clean, meaning they pack with snow.

If $$ is no object, studded BFG ATs are about ideal. They handle cold as well as heat very well, stay pliable, and clean themselves very well. They just don't like thick sticky mud too well, which is why I switched from ATs to my Hercules mudders about 5 years ago...

I will certainly digress to the expertese of the snowbound here. I have to drive, WAY out of my way to find snow, and even then, I have to drive into mountain passes to need to chain up / stud up, or even grab the T-case shifter...

Something I haven't seen mentioned here that I think needs to be brought up, if you are driving a 4x4, read, and follow your vehicle manufacturers recommendations, most 4x4 vehicles cannot be driven in 4 wheel drive at highway speeds.

The Ford truck forum guys have a good perspective on this whole thing about driving in 4 wheel drive at full road speed as well. You can read it HERE.

[leehljp]

Don't trust your instinctive reflexes. THAT is a response built upon experience of dry and wet driving. Ice and snow are different. And Ice driving is different from Snow driving.

Look up a driving school and see what it costs for a couple of hours of practice driving over a course with curves and wet smooth roads. Not quite like ice and snow but it will help. Tell them you want to go for a literal "spin". There is nothing like experience with spins and fishtails in a vehicle with oversteer or understeer to tax the normal instinctive reflexes! And it is FUN in controlled conditions!

Speed is your enemy unless you are going UP an icey, snowy hill. Learning when and how much to accelerate and how to decelerate to controll the vehicle is an imperative. Chains and cables are no substitute for this knowledge. Chains and cables are IN ADDITION to this knowledge and experience.

[durango dude]

whoops - forgot to add ---- take this class:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19FmqcE2PMU

[Black wallnut]

I've not seen studded tires that were not M&S rated but IME that rating is nearly meaningless. It could be that because I have always purchased all season that I have always had M&S rated tires, some good, some not as good and some worthless. I've never chained my 4wd all the way around and have never had issues with running 4wd at highway speeds, however only on other than dry pavement. That said I also do things not recommended by the vehicle manufacturers such as range shifts while moving..... you could say it is because of my experience as a truck driver. Shifting smoothly is a matter of matching engine RPM, gear speed and vehicle speed all at the same time, do that and you will not break parts.

One thing about winter driving is there are so many variables that you really need a big bag of tricks with any given trick being situation specific in that what works on dry powder may not work on deep wet snow which might not work on ice, etc.

[JR]

Jussi, you might also think about putting some coveralls, old gloves, ground cover or such on your checklist. The chain installation areas in California mountains are usually located at the transition from rain to snow, meaning it's a mess.