Lance Is Coming Back

[crokett]

Lance Armstrong is coming out of retirement. He says he wants to bring cancer awareness back to the forefront.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...x.html?eref=T1

[messmaker]

Those that quit when they were at the top have a hard time staying that way. It makes me a little sad. I think Barry Sanders and Jim Brown got it right.

[plarval]

I know I may be taking a less favorable view on his return, but I'm thinking it's been long enough that either he's confident the doping has completely left his body or he's found a new one that can't be detected. I commend him for all he has done for cancer research, and he seems like a really nice person, but in my eyes, all the evidence points towards a problem in his past. Cheaters are cheaters, even if they do raise millions of dollars for charity.

[LarryG]

all the evidence points towards a problem in his past.

What evidence, exactly? Armstrong was one of the most tested athletes on the planet, in any sport. He never tested positive for a banned substance. Never. Not once. Not ever.

Innuendo and accusations are NOT evidence.

[TB Roye]

They could never find any evidence of doping while he was racing. He did use some while he was recovering from cancer, that he admits to. I believe his illness and recovery made him tougher mentaly and physically. I hope he succedes, he has been doing Mt Bike racing so he probably is in good shape. I would love for him to bring the darn yellow shirt back to where in belongs, here. Both my Sons raced against him early in his career so we are looking forward to the Tour of California next year and will follow a good part of it.



Tom

[drumpriest]

Yes, he used EPO, which is a cancer drug, which he took, for cancer. I would say that the state of his body when it went into remission was not that of a top athlete. Perhaps we should make it such that pro athletes are never allowed to take EPO, so when they die of cancer, we can feel better about our sports.

I think it's a matter of his just falling out of the limelight. He is a great face for the promotion of cancer research, and the fickle public have lost interest in his story since he has retired. Coming back will probably bring back some of that media attention, which is in itself exposure for cancer awareness.

I dunno if he can win or not, maybe, I'll root for him though, as another win would certainly further his goals of having people care about cancer.

Tom, that's cool that your kids raced with him, I wasn't quite that good, but he did come win the thrift drug classic here in the burgh.

[plarval]

What evidence, exactly? Armstrong was one of the most tested athletes on the planet, in any sport. He never tested positive for a banned substance. Never. Not once. Not ever.

Innuendo and accusations are NOT evidence.

I don't think Barry Bonds ever tested positive either. How many other ball players have passed? His entire racing team failed tests, teammate Landis had his title stripped, his racing team was banned from the 2008 race. I know, it's not EVIDENCE, but it's pretty ****ing in my book. Sometimes you are no better than the people you surround yourself with. I think it's funny how the sporting world can totally shun someone like Bonds, and then completely support Armstrong. They are both basically in the same situation. Again, I applaud him for what he does for charity, but I just don't believe he was clean through that entire stretch. I could be completely wrong-my wife tells me that all the time.

[drumpriest]

Wait, when did his racing team fail? When did Postal as a team fail tests while Lance was riding for them?? I know of no such event. If you are referring to Astana, Lance never raced for Astana, and that was prior to Bruneal taking over, that's why the fired almost everyone from that team and started over.

As to Landis, that was on team Phonak, which Lance never raced on. By your logic if I know a guy who murdered 1000 people, then I am much more likely to have murdered 1000 people, though there exists no evidence of such a crime.

Armstrong tested with huge lunge capacity early in his career, pre-cancer, his ability after dropping 20 lbs was entirely predictable, he didn't suddenly double in size one year. I would not say the situations are comparable. Not to mention that cycling tests more often than any other sport, and Armstrong was tested more often than any other cyclist.

[JR]

Interesting. On cycling forums I expect this kind of thread to move to drugs allegations. I wasn't quite ready for it here.

It just shows how far the notion that athletes are doping has penetrated our thinking.

Yes, LA never tested positive. He says that all the time and it's a fact. He never says "I never doped". Makes me wonder what the fact is there.

As has been pointed out, the masking and microdosing techniques available are know to have allowed a number of dopers to get by without testing positive. Did Lance dope using these techniques? I surely don't know. His blood from the 99 TdF seems to have been proven to have EPO in it. That the test was not a proper test, but only for research, doesn't present a significant proof of actual innocence, IMHO. It just reinforces the notion that doping was/is rampant.

Flame away.

JR

[Black wallnut]

yada yada yada


Flame away.

JR

This is a no flame forum! Flame at your own peril.

[cgallery]

Lance did have a former teammate that did accuse him of doping, didn't he? I remember hearing a story on NPR, and these were the facts as I can remember them:

This former teammate was present when Lance was questioned by a doctor in the hospital during his cancer treatment. Lance was asked what drugs he had used, and Lance copped at that time to having used performance enhancements.

I believe the former tea mate's wife was present, and agrees with his description of events.

I also read somewhere that Lance had refused to make those medical records available.

I do have philosophical problems w/ the entire doping testing procedure. First, there have apparently been positives that resulted from athletes taking vitamins that contained substances that caused a positive result.

2nd, it would seem easy to me to eliminate entire groups of athletes by treating them all to Chinese take-out laced with substances that will show a positive result.

I'm not saying testing should not be done, but I think the method they go about it just doesn't work.

[jackellis]

I'm pleased that he's re-entering professional cycling, but my theory is that cycling was his life and it's all he knows. He's returning because he hasn't found anything else to do with his life. I don't mean for it to sound quite that bad but I can't find a better way to express the thought at this instant.

[JR]

This is a no flame forum! Flame at your own peril.

Thanks for the reminder, Mark! I really meant "my comments may be cotroversial or inflammatory, but I believe them to be true, and will be listening intently to any comments to the contrary". Now, reducing to my comments to "yada yada yada", that is inflammatory!

Lance did have a former teammate that did accuse him of doping, didn't he? I believe the former tea mate's wife was present, and agrees with his description of events.

Frankie Andreu, who had until that time been a highly respected mmenber of the American cycling community.

I do have philosophical problems w/ the entire doping testing procedure. ...it would seem easy to me to eliminate entire groups of athletes by treating them all to Chinese take-out laced with substances that will show a positive result.

I agree this is a serious threat. As it stands any rider who is rumored to have be involved with doping can be banned from racing, without respect to due process. A number of riders have been "outed" after failing their A sample test, before the B sample has been tested. This is a clear violation of the written process as well their human rights.

He's returning because he hasn't found anything else to do with his life.

Apparently serial dating of high-profile, beautiful women is not as fulfilling as previously thought!

JR

[HarmsWay]

Drug accusations aside I think it's sad that he can't just move on. He's been there and done that (exceptionally well). What more can he accomplish? If he's not at the top of the heap - which is likely the case - we get to witness his slide down. If is still is the best, that doesn't say much for the current crop of cyclists.

Bob

[kirkroy]

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/11/sp...ef=othersports