Thinking of getting a new car

[Mr__Bill]

I am thinking of traiding up my Bronco for a new car, think I can get a roof rack for this so I can still carry a sheet of plywood?

New car video

[LCHIEN]

I am thinking of traiding up my Bronco for a new car, think I can get a roof rack for this so I can still carry a sheet of plywood?

New car video

I don't think that car is very green. I think you need this car, at $92K it's 1/16th the cost of the Bugatti and it can do a very respectable 130 mph without using any gasoline, to boot.

http://www.teslamotors.com/

Forget the plywood.

[Uncle Cracker]

Yeah, Loring, but the Tesla's got 5000 HF batteries, and only comes with a single-cell charger...

[crokett]

Mr Bill, I think if you put a sheet of plywood on the roof of that car, you'd end up with Scaramanga's flying car from the Man With the Golden Gun

[gsmittle]

I don't think that car is very green. I think you need this car, at $92K it's 1/16th the cost of the Bugatti and it can do a very respectable 130 mph without using any gasoline, to boot.

http://www.teslamotors.com/

Forget the plywood.

The plywood might blow off unless you have a REALLY sturdy roof rack.

g.

[Mr__Bill]

Yeah, the 12 min to a tank of gas was rather disturbing.

I am wondering, with electric cars, do you count the source of the electricity and part of the 'green' factor? Where I live now most of th electricity comes from Hydro (Columbia River Power System, Bonneville Power). However, for many years I lived where the source was nuclear. Can't help but think that an Atomic Car would not be all that green.

Either way, until Hot Wheels comes out with one I may have to settle for my Bronco.

[Mr__Bill]

Mr Bill, I think if you put a sheet of plywood on the roof of that car, you'd end up with Scaramanga's flying car from the Man With the Golden Gun

I was kind of envisioning a of Mr Bean moment.

[LCHIEN]

Yeah, Loring, but the Tesla's got 5000 HF batteries, and only comes with a single-cell charger...

They claim a city/hiway combined range of 245 miles, "aggressive" driving range of 160 miles (accelerating 0-60 in under 4 seconds at every stop sign, I guess) and a full recharge from residential AC in 3.5 hours.

[kirkroy]

I am wondering, with electric cars, do you count the source of the electricity and part of the 'green' factor?

You have to, don't you? Seems to me that's the biggest thing missing when the average person discusses electric cars. Making the electricity could be worse than driving a dino fueled car...

[Mr__Bill]

I suppose that with a car like this you could have Home depot deliver some of that high-quality-flat-smooth birch plywood... and not worry about how to carry it. Perhaps you can get it with a class II hitch and use a HF trailer.

But really, I think we now know where all those Dell Batteries went to when they recalled them.



The thing is... it would be a really hard choice between the shop and parking the Tesla out of the rain...oh well, my next daydream is a finish that works right the first time.

Bill on the sunny Oregon Coast

[LCHIEN]

Yeah, the 12 min to a tank of gas was rather disturbing.

I am wondering, with electric cars, do you count the source of the electricity and part of the 'green' factor? Where I live now most of th electricity comes from Hydro (Columbia River Power System, Bonneville Power). However, for many years I lived where the source was nuclear. Can't help but think that an Atomic Car would not be all that green.

Either way, until Hot Wheels comes out with one I may have to settle for my Bronco.

Green means many things to many people.
I think the most common definition of green right now (due to global warming concerns) is to use non-CO2 generating sources which means that hyro-electric and wind power as well as atomic sources would be green by that definition. Almost anything that's not fossil fuels.

Another definition of green is minimal impact. Bicycles are very green. Mini cars that get 50 mpg are green and huge SUVs are non green simply becaue they waste too many resources to get a job done (mom and kids to soccer practice).

Atomic power does everything in a super large scale. If there are no accidents, and the waste is disposed of safely then its a superbly clean source. Give us one serious accident that contaminates an area the size of a state and kill's 10,000 people, is that still "green"? what's the liklihood of such an event? No one knows for sure, not enough experience. Accidents do happen because we're all human.

[LCHIEN]

You have to, don't you? Seems to me that's the biggest thing missing when the average person discusses electric cars. Making the electricity could be worse than driving a dino fueled car...

In almost all scenarios electricity generated at a power plant is better than gasoline burned in a car:

• Energy is maximzed for the fuel used - constant speed generators can be optimized for maximum efficiency and there's no idling - BTU recovery is higest for a fixed plant. Gasoline engines are very low efficiency.
• Fixed plants can have better pollution control - easier to control and monitor one fixed source than 10,000 or 100,000 moving sources.
• For rechargeable cars, being charged at night represents the best case because total electrical usage is usually lower, the electrical utility companies can operate their most efficient plants to charge your car.
• renewable energy sources can be used to charge the car. Alternate fuels may be also be used at the plant, but its much more difficult in the car.

---
The most serious problem for electrical cars is the energy density - the energy stored in a 18 gallon gas tank is (1) replaceable in about 5 minutes at a convenient roadside station, and (2) takes a fraction of the space and weight of an equivalent set of batteries and (3) ties up $50-the cost of the tank - in capital vs. $3000 -the cost of batteries - in capital expense. Gasoline has some very desireable properties. In addition, flammable as it is, its really pretty safe when containerized correctly.
A 500 lb. Lithium ion battery may be a time bomb. (think laptop battery recalls this year)

[dkerfoot]

I am wondering, with electric cars, do you count the source of the electricity and part of the 'green' factor? Where I live now most of th electricity comes from Hydro (Columbia River Power System, Bonneville Power). However, for many years I lived where the source was nuclear. Can't help but think that an Atomic Car would not be all that green..

Actually a nuclear powered car would be quite green (so long as nothing goes terribly wrong) - but most of the electric power in the US comes from good old coal. Yes - electric cars are really coal powered cars. So, while driving your electric cars, perhaps you want to say a prayer for the poor folks riding the elevators down into the ground for your sake.

But you can feel good knowing that coal itself is fairly earth-friendly compared to the very nasty batteries that have to be disposed of every 3-5 years in electric and hybrid cars.

But quite honestly, I am for just about anything that reduces our dependence on the Middle East. Build nukes in my backyard, strip-mine Anwar, build miles of wind-farms in the path of migratory birds - whatever.

Seriously. We need to become energy independent regardless of the cost.

[maxparot]

If you can afford a Tesla chances are you can afford to install a Photovoltaic electric system for your home and then be truly green.