Air nailer suggestion for fencing

[brian]

I'm getting ready to put up some fencing, and I could use a recommendation.

The fence is a dog-ear style, with 1x6 pickets mounted to two 2x4 rails with 4x4 posts every 8' or so. I did a section on the other side of the house years ago, and it's held up well with the dog leaning on it. I put the 4x4's in oversize post holes with cement and they're pretty solid.

On the short section I did before, I attached the pickets with screws to avoid hammering and possibly loosening the posts. This was before I discovered this forum and the wonder of air tools.

I'm thinking a nailer would make the job quicker and wouldn't shock the posts too much. My questions are:

Will the nailer impart much shock to the posts? I've only got a small nailer at the moment, don't know how the larger ones behave.

If a nailer is the way to go, what gage should I be looking for? Keep in mind my max nail length will only be about 2"

Suggestions for a reasonably priced nailer? I can't see investing a few hundred bucks on something I won't use very often. I'm more into furniture making than large home improvements.

Finally, (yes, finally) is this a good route to go? The section built with screws has held up very well. Never a loose picket. Are framing nails glue-coated? What would you recommend, especially since it will be exposed to the weather. Okay, that was more than on question.

I'll stop now and bask in the glow of your illuminating answers!

[kwgeorge]

Most fences down here that are nailed up have problems as they age. The nails rust and start working there way out. The way to deal with this is to use Ring Shank Galvanized nails or Screw Shank nails. If you are going to shoot them with a nail gun I have found that a roofing coil nail gun works very well for this with Zink coated ring shank nails.

[Whaler]

In my opinion you will need a framing nailer to hold the boards in place. The impact from the nailer should not be a factor.

Rather than buying a framing nailer I would suggest using deck screws. If you don't have a good drill/driver pick up a 1/4" impact driver, you will probably find that you can't live without it. I have the DW052K2 and it is the only tool I grab to drive screws. I also have a PC framing nailer but only use it for rough work.

[crokett]

Go with screws. At our old house before I replaced the fence, I saw the difference nails vs scres make on the old fence. As long as the cement is cured, a nailer won't hurt anything. Heck, as long as the cement is cured, you can wale away all you want with a hammer and you won't hurt anything.

[monte]

The framing nailer should work with no problems but I suggest you use either galvanized or stainless nails.

[Mainemarc]

Hi Brian:

I'd urge you to reconsider using nails. Galvanized or stainless steel screws are much better at resisting warpage and pulling as the fence weathers. (Pre-drill if you're worried about stressing the wood).

One of the advantages of doing things yourself is that while it takes a lot longer, you can generally do a much better job than the story-bought, mass-produced alternatives.

Sure, most factory-made fencing uses crown staples or air-driven nails, but that's entirely due to economy and efficiency, not quality.

[silverfox]

I'm with most of the guys on this one....use coated deck screws. You'll be glad you did.
Mike

[brian]

Sounds like screws is the winner!

Appreciate the comments. The screws might take a little longer, but I can't imagine it'll be that much. Like I said, the section I built several years ago is still strong and warp-free.

I used some type of galvanized screws the first time, square drive. I'll probably stick with the square drive, but it did tend to rub some of the coating off and some are showing some rust. I'm sure there are better choices now.

Thanks again!

[MBG]

Brian - If you have a lot of fencing I would suggest a framing nailer. They make SS, galvanized, and aluminum nails for this application. As mentioned above ring-shanked nails would be best - they are nearly impossible to remove. Also, many nails are coated with an adhesive that melts going into the wood due to friction.

Mike

[Tom Slick]

I recently used ring shank SS nails (coastal area) in a framing nailer to build my fence on the reccomendation of a contractor friend. the difference in the amount of time it will take to screw in screws or shoot in a nails will be considerable. if it is alot of fencing you could be talking hours of a time difference. ring shanks will hold on for a very long time.
I have seen fences that were stapled together with a roofing stapler and the boards are now falling off after 5 years.

[jAngiel]

quote:Originally posted by brian

The screws might take a little longer, but I can't imagine it'll be that much.

It takes A LOT longer! Screws may be better but when I did my 400 feet of fence 6 years ago I started with screws but it was taking waaayyyy to long so I switched to stainless ringshank and a framing nailer. I finished the pickets in a few hours, and that was putting them on alternate sides of the runners. After six years (I know its not really that long) both are still holding strong, and thats six years of Oklahoma wind.

I would use a fraiming nailer with the stainless ringshank unless you like to spend 8 times as long as you need to to get something done.

[MPod]

If you haven't finalized your decision yet I'll throw in my 2 cents. I did my fence five years ago now. Dog ear cedar in a shadow box pattern.

I researched this quite a bit before starting. Kansas State University's materials testing lab did a research project to determine whether nails or staples would have the most holding power several years ago. In summary, Staples won hands down. Most of the fence contractors around here use staples as well.

You would need to rent/borrow/ or buy a wide crown stapler. I believe the crown is 1/2" wide but I can check if you'd like.

I borrowed a Senco from a family friend. It went very fast and five years later you can't pull the pickets off without a crow bar (and then it aint easy).

Some things to consider: Do not use galvanized (Like I did). Cedar reacts with the galanization and your cedar will bleed black streaks due to the reaction. Use Stainless Steel fasteners instead.

I shot three staples into each rail. My fence had three rails so each picket received nine staples. Most fences in my neighborhood only used two and some of those pickets are cupping.

If you are using a consistant gap between pickets (such as in a shadow box), here's a way to greatly speed up the process: Rip down a board to match your gap width. This will become your spacing jig. Mount a long handle vertically and a small level to this spacing jig.

When installing your pickets, Have a helper hold the spacing jig against the edge of the first picket you installed. Grab your second picket, push it up against the spacing jig, check the height, and fire away. Continue until done. Once you get in a groove, this will go really fast.

Also note that the person using the spacing jig should also be checking for level as you go by eyeing the small level installed on the board.

Using this method and a helper, I installed 150' of rails and pickets on both sides in one afternoon the shadow box spacing turned out perfect and it went up as fast as a conventional fence.

My property is on a ridge that gets constant wind and some wicked storms (tornado country). My fence is still solid as a rock and don't have a loose picket anywhere.

Frankly, the problems I've seen with other fences had less to do with the picket fasteners and more to do with shallow and/or narrow post holes. Around hear the post holes must be at least 3' deep to avoid frost upheaval. Don't skimp on the concrete either.

Hope this helps.

[brian]

Hmmmm, maybe it's not so clear cut....

I was probably a little quick to dismiss the extra length of time it would take to use screws. Certainly a framing nailer is very fast, expecially compared to driving four screws. I did twist the heads off a couple on my first fence as well. I've got about 140' of fence to do with two gates, so it's not a whole lot, but it's a good size job. Certainly getting the pickets done in a day or less is very attractive. Eventually I'll do the stretch across the back of the yard, so that's probably another 125'.

So a question for the nail crowd. As I really don't do much in the way of framing, is there perhaps a HF framing nailer that can be recommended? I'll do a search here as well, but thought I'd ask while I'm typing.

Thanks again, all. It's given me a lot to consider.


-brian