Dust Seperator - DO or DONT?

[footprintsinconc]

hello everyone!

I just purchased a dust collector: delta 50-760. its a 110v model, 1.5HP and 1200cfm (supposidly). now the questions is if i should built a dust seperator for it or not. if i do, it will go immediately under the inlet of the unit and the can will sit on the roller base of the unit so its compact. i dont think i can get a 30gal can under it, i may have to cut about 10" off the bottom of the can and modify it.

i have read some post about it being useful and others saying its not useful, infact nothing ends up staying in the can.

so the $1 mil question: for the unit that i have, has anyone found it to be useful or not? what size can if so and is it worth getting the seperator lid sold at rockler or should i just make one like in the article: http://www.woodcraft.com/articles.aspx?articleid=408

any other adivce will be really helpful and appreciated.

thanks for the help!


EDIT: please post some pictures if you have a setup with the seperator. it will be helpful -- thanks once again.

[vaking]

Cleaning the DC can be annoying if you have DC with bags. Separator makes cleaning less frequent because most dust supposed to stay in a can. Whether it does or not - depends on what you build. The risk is that DC too powerful and can too small combination results in DC overpowering the separator and sucking everything right through. 1.5HP should not be too strong. The opposite side risk is if you make an elaborate plumbing with DC hooked up to several places at once - the separator will reduce the suction so there will be not enough left.
I don't have a DC like yours - mine is very small and I was afraid that collector will reduce the suction too much. The result I built not a cyclone separator which takes very little pressure and it works well. It is using a very small can (10 gal) and 80% stays in. The can and DC are mounted on same platform and roll together. I connect 1 machine at a time and DC rolls to the machine I use at the time.

[footprintsinconc]

thanks for the info.

my setup is really small, so i will be wheelling the dc to the machine. the hookup hose will be 5ft long. if i make the seperator, i plan on using an approx 25gal can. i dont know if i should just make the lid or buy the lid from rockler.

can you post a picture of your setup? -- thanks

[Lonnie in Orlando]

I used a 30gal galvanized trash can to make my separator for my 1-hp Delta DC. My own Rube Goldberg design. Like you, I connect one tool at a time.

I'm out of town; will try to post pics when I return.

I use the separator when I am connected to my planer, jointer, or when I am cleaning the floor. This is because long shavings will plug up the safety cross bar in the DC inlet, and because it catches hard items from the floor (nuts, bolts, etc.) before they can damage the impellers. I don't use the separator for most other tools.

- Lonnie

[SARGE..g-47]

Morning FP...

Before just installing a PS cyclone, I used a separator with my small 1 HP PS DC and it worked great dropping large stuff in the can. Vaking "nailed it" with stating that rolling the DC to the machine is the "ticket" if you use the separator. A separator will reduce air flow and air flow is what is necessary if you set up a ducted system.

I kept the PS 1 HP and took the separator off to use a 4" hook-up to my SCMS and router table with a Y to get a 2" hose to fence and lower cabinet with the router and fence and dust port on the SCMS. But... after taking the separator off.. I replaced the bottom felt bag with a plastic disposable offered by Penn State. I can see when it fills to the point I need to empty it and I will add that "don't let it get too full" as it will reduce air flow and fine dust will be forced out the top filter bag.

The cyclone speaks for itself.. I did not run an elaborate duct system as I got wise and centered the "clone" and then circled my major dust makers (20" planer.. 8" jointer.. 18" BS.. Unisaw) around it. That gives me the longest run of around 16" feet with 6" pipe from the cyclone direct to each machine which have all been modifed with 6" dust ports. Takes about 1 minute to switch the 6" pipe from one machine to another.

And I will add.. my guess was correct that by keeping the run short.. minimum drops and no reductions at the machine, it willl literally "suck your shirt off". I placed a wire screen where my flex pipe meets PCV connector and we placed a T-shirt on the floor about 6" from the mouth of the flex pipe. When we turned loose of the shirt it launched into the pipe with the speed of a ground to ground missle after it hoovers just after leaving the pad and then "gone down-range". I was impressed with the results.

Regards...

[cgallery]

I have observed that some people complain their separators reduce suction enough that they can't use DC networks. However, a lot of these users seem to be using those molded plastic tops that don't seal to the top of the can or the hoses very well. Once they either make an effort to seal them better, or replace them w/ home made ones (like per the instructions on the Woodcraft site), lots of the lost suction returns.

[SARGE..g-47]

Morning CG...

Amen to o your post.... I had one of the older twist in-let style lids which I don't see anymore. Mostly the straight pipe set up which I personally don't feel gets the air circulating in that can as well.

Seal all seams with silcone caulk... All! dI added campers tape aroung the rim of the 30 gallon can and then strapped it down with a nylon boat strap and rachet up and over the can lid attached to mobile base with eye hooks screwed in it. At this point the air flow increased as the slightest leak will reduce it.

And that's all I know about dust collectors... so I'm outside to work on the house cause the "boss-lady" said to get off "her" computer. And what the "boss-lady" says is more important than DC. ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..

Regards...

[Turaj]

I have the same DC and a shop made seperator. I think it works very nicely! I have not noticed major drop in air movement (even with jointer and planer) and it is a lot easier to empty the seperator! As you can see mine sits next to my DC .

[Jeffrey Schronce]

The cyclone speaks for itself.. I did not run an elaborate duct system as I got wise and centered the "clone" and then circled my major dust makers (20" planer.. 8" jointer.. 18" BS.. Unisaw) around it. That gives me the longest run of around 16" feet with 6" pipe from the cyclone direct to each machine which have all been modifed with 6" dust ports. Takes about 1 minute to switch the 6" pipe from one machine to another.

As I commented before, I love the way you did this layout.

BTW, do you have any posts on your RT?

[footprintsinconc]

well thanks everyone. great posts!

sarge, i love your setup, its really well organized - i am far from that. at the end of the day, i have to push everything back into the garage. i saw your can with the curved plastic cover for the seperator in an older post. that is the same one that rockler sells. in your opinion, is it worth just getting that one and a can or get a can and make one like woodcraft's website shows?

thanks for the pics turaj. i like the clear cover idea, that was neat. now does that mean the seperator doesnt need to be circular? also i see three pipes, 2 4" and one 2", what is the third pipe for? and can you explain the two top comparments (one big and the other small)? i see the latches on one side of the lid, how do you empty it, isnt it a little too heavy (the weight of the wood cabinet alone) to lift and dump?

these have been helpful, just let it keep coming. -- thanks everyone!

[newood2]

Here's a link to a previous thread on my setup.
http://www.bt3central.com/showthread.php?t=27850
So far it's working fantastic. The separator is 55gal barrel. About quarter full so far and still no visible dust in the bottom plastis bag or the filter, and it sucks like crazy on the longest run, 25 feet with 3- 45deg and 2- 90deg bends. I use 5" metal piping on horizontal and 4" metal on the drops.

Howie

[SARGE..g-47]

Evening Jeff...

Thanks for the compliment, it's working out real well... I think as I have been painting for several weeks and would love to get back to the shop to start a bedroom suite and challenge it.

"BTW, do you have any posts on your RT"?... Jeff
*****

I must have been on that ladder too long. I think you are referring to the Router Table (RT) but do I have any post on it? Am I missing something in my exhaustion or did you mean pics or pictures?

If you would be so kind as to clarify so an old man can give a proper answer if within my power.

Regards...

[SARGE..g-47]

Evenig FP...

If you want to just get it done and over with to move on.. I would just get the Rockler as we aren't talking major $$. If you don't have any projects lined up in the immediate future.. you could build it and save a few $$ but nothing significant.

It's sort of one of those personal decisions that would be best answered by you!

Regards...

[footprintsinconc]

another question

sarge, thanks for the advice. i've got a 100 projects planned, let alone, my work bench isnt complete yet. just wanted to make sure, you thought that it functioned well.

besides, does it the seperator need to be circular? can it be a square and still function?

regards,

[Jeffrey Schronce]

Evening Jeff...

Thanks for the compliment, it's working out real well... I think as I have been painting for several weeks and would love to get back to the shop to start a bedroom suite and challenge it.

"BTW, do you have any posts on your RT"?... Jeff
*****

I must have been on that ladder too long. I think you are referring to the Router Table (RT) but do I have any post on it? Am I missing something in my exhaustion or did you mean pics or pictures?

If you would be so kind as to clarify so an old man can give a proper answer if within my power.

Regards...

Sorry! Do you have a thread on the RT that contains photos, etc? Seems like a pretty cool set up.