Bench top and point of Diminishing returns?

[Jeff]

quote:Originally posted by Jeff

(576, plus or minus)

Well, they should be arriving from the plater on or about wednesday, gold ones in 5/16-18, blue ones in 1/4-20, pilot hole ones in silver steel.
I can't wait to see the blue ones, never have seen blue zinc myself.
BTW, they are modified for the plastic ends, and the pilot hole sizes are a very limited edition at this point, and probably 1/3 of them are already destined for Japan and England. But I still have some more and no one has placed a regular order for any.
Also, the prices were reduced slightly to account for change in shipping.

If you guys have pictures of them in use, send them my way and I'll post them on the site, and if you have a write-up on a project or jig or whatever, send those too!
If anyone plans to order additional t-nuts (ie repeat customers), please contact me via email first (so I can give some kind of repeat customer discount-- haven't automated that part yet).



Jeff in Beaumont
http://t-nuts.com/bt3c
Chromosomes: Monkeys, 44. Humans, 46. Sweet potato, 48. Przewalski's Horse, 66. Forest fern, 144.
Evolution? Yeah right.

Well, they are in, I have them in my truck and will begin boxing tonight for shipping beginning tomorrow.

A quick note on the "blue" zinc......It seems that the plating company's idea of blue is a bit off, since the machinist and I both agree, in whole, that they look silver.

"This is blue?" he asked them. "It looks like silver."
>>"That's what blue looks like."
"So why don't they just call it silver?"
>>"Cuz it's not. It's blue. That's the way it looks."
"Howcome I got some from you guys before that were BLUE blue?"
>>"Those were anodized."

What can you do.

I told him to ask them for some SAMPLES of all the zinc plated steel colors they have so we can know what we are going to get.

Anyway, the silver zinc steel actually looks pretty good, shiny like silver with a hint of blue. I'll have pics when I get them taken and posted.

I am afraid to ask for red zinc......don't know if slightly-off pink would go well with all y'all....

Jeff in Beaumont
http://t-nuts.com/bt3c
Chromosomes: Monkeys, 44. Humans, 46. Sweet potato, 48. Przewalski's Horse, 66. Forest fern, 144.
Evolution? Yeah right.

[Jim-Iowa]

Bench top and point of Diminishing returns?

For about 15 yrs I have been getting along with an improvised workbench. It was once a folding lab table from a school lab.
I put a plywood top on by putting a 20" section of 1/2" plywood over a 26" section. mounted a vise that had belonged to my wife`s great grandfather on the end.

It was too light and too low. While I intend to make a proper wooded legged bench, I intend to make a new top for this to use till that gets done, then move the top to the new bench.
Since, I have decided to sacrifice some on the top and put that money in a better vise.
I was thinking of making a 36"X5ft top of 3/4 MDF and cap that with masonite hardboard. My debate at this time is how many layers?
would 1 1/2" be thick enough or should I go to 3"?
Do you think there is a point of diminishing returns?

[Tom Miller]

I think 3" would be overkill. And choosing between 2 or 3 layers of MDF will depend a little on how the top will be supported. But if you plan to have a bench vise on an overhanging end, I'd suggest 3 layers of 3/4 MDF. That's what I used on this:




Regards,
Tom

[LarryG]

If your aim is to get the bench as heavy as possible, I'm not so sure 3" would be overkill. I just built a torsion box assembly platform consisting of a 1/2" MDF grid (about 7.5" squares) with a 3/4" MDF outer frame, 1/2" MDF skins top and bottom, and 5/8" oak trim around the edges. It measures 42" x 60" x 4" thick and I would guess it only weighs about 100-125 lbs. It's heavy enough for my purposes (assembly only) but I don't think it would be steady enough for use as a Neander-style woodworking bench.

[Tundra_Man]

Mine is 1 1/2" (2 layers) of MDF over a 2x4 frame. Seems plenty sturdy.

[maxparot]

Mine is 1 layer of particle board with a layer of MDF on top. 2x4 frame.

[lrogers]

I used three layers on mine, but that was to lock in the the inserts I use for my portable tools. It's solid, but man, it's heavy. You can click on th link below to see what I came up with.

[Ryan F]

Mine is 3 layers also, edge banded with 1 1/2" oak. Plenty strong.

[Mainemarc]

quote:Originally posted by Jim-Iowa

My debate at this time is how many layers?
would 1 1/2" be thick enough or should I go to 3"?
Do you think there is a point of diminishing returns?

Three comments:

Jim:

1) I agree that 1-1/2" should be fine. But you need to make sure the legs and aprons are up to the task. I don't necessarily mean up to bearing the static weight vertically. Multiple layers of MDF are going to make an extremely large rigid mass up high. Especially with your comment that your workbench started life as a *folding* lab table, you want the supporting structure to be stout and rigid enough to resist the tremendous racking forces it will be exposed to.

This is doubly important if you'll be using hand tools.

Otherwise, you'll go from a concern of diminishing concerns to one of exposing a different weakness in the structure.

Ryan:

2) Nice work bench!

3) What is that jig you have hanging on the wall, next to your claimp rack in your second picture?

[Jim-Iowa]

Hey everyone! Thanks for your comments and especially the pictures.
I am not totally sure which way I am going with my woodworking yet.
I used to be a Tim the Toolman type, thinking that if it could not be done with power tools it was not worth doing.
Now I fid myself at 55 thinking that since I have no handtool skills, it is time I learned? I doubt I will go totally neanderthal.
probably a blending of techniques.
I think I will go with 3 layers and banding. I was thinking of putting the hardboard on with Carpet tape( banding would stop movement), so it could be changed easily if damaged.
Tom: I like your bench, I think drawers will be something added after the fact.
Larry:Torsion Box would be good, but at this point I am looking for quick, so will save that idea for the assembly table later.

Ryan: I really like your bench and is what I really have in mind.
I especially apreciate your showing the underside and how it is attatched to the legs. I like the striped pattern on the legs, what woods did you use? My guess was pine or poplar(and since we have a mutual admiration for red oak) oak?

Mainemarc: Yes I had considered that the folding table had limitations. My intent is to put the top on that table temporarily while making a base simular to Ryans.
Then the folding table, being only about 29" tall will be relegated to an assembly table.

A lot of good ideas here! Keep them coming.
I understand no one ever builds just one bench, so any ideas not used on this project may go in another.

As an after thought, my current bench got a 4" lift last night by doubling 2" material between the top and base, at 34" it is now much better.

[Ryan F]

Oak and pine. []
This is my webpage with more pictures. I have a plan somewhere.....

http://www.kcflahertys.com/wood/gall...workbench.html

Edit: Jig is a picture frame clamp.

[Tom Miller]

Here's a couple more things to consider:

Regarding the hardboard top layer -- I have it on my miter saw bench, but decided against it here. Unless it's glued down you might end up with a ripple. And when you use a mallet and chisel, you get kind of a sickly thud from any air gap. I wanted a dead flat and solid top.

You might have better results, so I suggest you try the concept. Another advantage to a removeable top is that you can countersink carriage bolts to hold your vises. (Added later: the countersunk carriage bolt heads are hidden under -- and accessible under -- the removeable top.)

When you glue up your MDF layers, make sure you're working on a known flat surface.

(And now the truth is out: my bench legs are cheap RyanF knockoffs. [])

Regards,
Tom

[ejs1097]

quote:Originally posted by Jim-Iowa


A lot of good ideas here! Keep them coming.
I understand no one ever builds just one bench, so any ideas not used on this project may go in another.

Since you are edge banding the top and going with 3 layers, bury the vise into the top so the non-movable face of the vise is behind the edging. Your edging becomes the face and gives you a long edge that your work sits against. (Like Ryan's set up)

[Jim-Iowa]

Tom, Sorry I totally missed the fact that your bench legs were made the same way!

EJS1097: Actually the vice I currently have had no back on it and uses the rail as one face(it bolts to the bottom of the top). It will go on the front of the new bench.
There probably are better vices but,call it sentimental,that vice was used by my wifes great grandfather. Who I met when he was 93, he had been a cabinetmaker in Iowa for most of his life. And I keep hoping some of that old Swiss craftsmanship might somehow rub off if I use some of his tools.
There is an old moulding plane stashed away, for the time I can clean up ans sharpen the chisels too.
I have yet to resolve the tail vice for the end issue

[ejs1097]

sounds like a great reliable vise, little things like that make wookworking all much more relaxing and better thinking about the sentimental value when using the tool.