shoulder to cry on...

[DaveS]

I'm not really looking for any advice here, just looking to share my pain.

We bought a 25 year old house in June. Every room is wallpapered.

I finally found someone to take down the wallpaper for a fair price.

They started last week, and so far they have found:

(1) an active leak in a bedroom, hidden by the wallpaper - need to replace about 50 square feet of drywall

(2) a foundation water problem hidden by the wallpaper - I have some drainage issue up front, and now I need to replace (of course, after I fix the drainage problem) about 100 square feet of spongy, mildewed drywall in a curved stairwell - that's gonna cost me.

All the wallpaper is the plastic or vinyl type that hides water very nicely.

I'm afraid what they will find next...

I will never buy a wallpapered house again

[cabinetman]

It's a shame that some people can be destructively creative. Some things even home inspections don't turn up. So, other than the expense incurred you did learn a valuable lesson, and sharing it here is definitely a heads up for others.
.

[jseklund]

Just the Realtor in me coming out here- but did you have a home inspection? This isn't meant as a criticism or to be taken as, "You idiot, what were you thinking?" Many people forgo home inspections and get by fine. I just bought a home around the same time with no inspection. I did crawl around everything and planned on fixing a large number of things- but there were still some suprises (undersized joists in the basement for one).

My thought is that even if the wall paper covered the internal damage- it is still a leak and should have shown some signs elsewhere- roof, attic, etc. If you had a home inspector come through...maybe they should have caught it. I know we're in an overly litigious society, but many home inspectors try harder to put the deal together and make the Realtors happy (hoping we'll refer them to others) than to actually inspect the home and serve their real customer.

I wish you the best. Coming from someone who has just completed a remodel, I know you're not looking for advice, but here it is anyway-

1. Maybe you can do some or most of the repair yourself. Drywall can be a bit frustrating, and takes a little skill- but it's definately achievable. Curves can be tough....but there are plenty of resources to use on how to do it yourself.

2. If you do it yourself, you can see what is really damaged. If a 2X4 has rotted and a contractor is being paid....he may not take the extra effort to replace 1-2 pieces of wood that won't be seen. You will do it right.

3. Get three quotes (of course). However, caveat emptor with contractors. Low price and high price mean nothing. I've had low priced hacks and high priced hacks. I've had people who seemed very trustworthy screw things up. Find someone who is detailed oriented- they may cost a little more, but they care about their work. And usually they'll be cheaper both short term and long term than others.

Good luck, I wish you the best.

[Sugarman]

In PA everyone must file out a homeowners disclosure form. All the items you mentioned are covered by that form. I would look at it very closely. If you don't have a copy ask for one from the listing Realtor. They must give it to you. It should be filled out in the homeowners hand. You may want to determine when the wallpapering was done relative to the sale of the house and how long it appears the problems existed. It sounds to me like you have recourse. PA has very strong laws regarding this type of fraud. If the house was a "flipper" (bought and sold quickly by an investor) they may try and say they never lived in the house and were unaware of the issues. It may take some work and perseverance on your part but I would be surprised if you cannot be compensated by someone. If you suspect the Realtors may have known about these problems contact the local board of Realtors and/or the state Real Estate Commission and file a complaint. You will get action then.
I wish you the best and I'm sorry someone put you in this position.

Ron (a former PA agent)

[DaveS]

Yes, I had a home inspection. And he found many things (mostly minor), and a couple big things we made them fix.

The reason the leak in the wall was not obvious (to me, or the inspector), is that they replaced the roof a couple years ago - and there are various ceiling patches from previous leaks - all of which are ok (dry, not a bad patch, no mildew in the attic, etc.).

However, when I went into the attic (which is a **huge** space - the peak must be 16 feet or more), and flashed a light over at where the leak was (valley by a chimney), I saw the water stains immediately - I'm not sure why he didn't.

I tend to try to look at people as "generally honest", and as such, I get burned a lot... in this case, in my mind, the owner didn't realize the chimney was leaking - just painted over what looked like an old stain to her? We bought the house from the original owners that built it 25 years ago.

I have the disclosure, and what is says about leaks is all "prior to new roof".

I see the problem with the basement wall, the gutter is way-way undersized for the amount of water coming off this roof and it is overflowing down near the foundation.

I suspect these gutters were put on with the new roof, and so it has been dumping water for a couple years - enough to wreck the drywall and possibly the furring strips - but not bad enough to cause any structural damage - I will know more after the tear out.

Regarding doing the work myself - I will have these guys do the tear out - and I will inspect all the framing. I am generally a "do-it-yourselfer", and as such, I will try to do as much as I can myself... the problem these days is time...

I have done dry wall before - and this wouldn't be too bad, as it is in a stair well to the basement - no scaffolding or ladders needed, and if I mess it up it won't be obvious -

but it is a curved area - probably about a 5 foot radius - I have a feeling this type of drywall is not for beginners

I'll post some pictures shortly...

[Uncle Cracker]

First thing I'd do is ask for a refund from your home inspector. Then, I'd find out who did the wallpaper job and hire him next time you need it done, because an active moisture problem is very hard to conceal with wallpaper (old stains are easy). I make it a policy any time I am looking at a property to add a fudge factor of 10% of the purchase price, in addition to needed repairs that I can see. This covers hidden contingencies, and if the number doesn't add up, I walk. There's always something that escapes your attention, but this case sounds like a your inspector should have been more thorough.

[DaveS]

Near as I can tell, the wallpaper is 25 years old.

It is really heavy stuff - I think it is vinyl... the whole thing peels off in one piece leaving only the wall paper paste on the wall.

It seems impervious to water.

I think I have an idea why we didn't notice these problems - we bought the home during the dry season - the lawn was very brown.

The leak in the roof is in the flashing by a chimney, and it seems that it doesn't get a lot of water - unless a bunch of snow slides down the roof and piles up in that valley. I had a roofer come out today and fix it - $80, what a bargain. I game him $100 and told him "happy holidays".

Regarding the drainage - I think I have multiple problems - one is the gutters are too small, another is that they are currently full of leaves, finally, I noticed that one of the gutter ends has a huge leak in it.

I have some work to do

[BrianStark]

I have some work to do

I can feel your pain. The home I bought last year had several roof leaks just recently. I was lucky enough to have discovered the problem on the first real rain day of this winter season to deal with it quickly. I never noticed any problems the first winter, which makes me wonder why I have several leaks now. Probably doesn't matter. Priority #1 is taking care of the leaks.

I found out that unless you have major damage to your roof (like a tree falling on it), insurance doesn't really want to deal with your problems. Actually, have any type of water leaking problems today and nobody really wants to deal with you.

When I found my leaks, I stressed out big time. I got into my attic as quick as I could, located the areas where the leaks were originating from, put buckets there, pulled out the wet attic insulation batts and prayed for no more leaks.

I did some quick research on the products available at the local HD and I picked up several gallons of roofing repair stuff (Henrys # 208R and # 209), patching fabric, disposable gloves, plastic spatulas and a large plastic tarp and some rope. Following the products directions, I did my best and patched the places where I knew water was coming in from and the places where I suspected it was or might come in from. My roof patches don't look pretty, but hey, it is a flat roof. I still have some smaller things to tackle... Need to get up there soon and determine if I can just use some lithium grease on my whirlybird/turbines or if replacing them is the better way to go. Some roof drains are weeping water into the attic down their drain pipes. After looking at the roof-side and attic-side I'm still not sure how to deal with that.

As for your wallboard work, if you can do the work, you will save money. If it were me, I would look for the help of someone experienced in taping. Cutting and putting up drywall is one thing. Getting a nice clean smooth taped joint eludes me.

Do you have any residual effects from the water to worry about? Mold? Insects(termites)/rodents attracted by the water/moisture?

The good thing, is that these types of problems do have solutions. The unfortunate part is that there are usually some large upfront costs that catch most people off guard.

I wish you the best of luck in your repairs.

Brian

[eccentrictinkerer]

The leak in the roof is in the flashing by a chimney, and it seems that it doesn't get a lot of water - unless a bunch of snow slides down the roof and piles up in that valley. I had a roofer come out today and fix it - $80, what a bargain. I game him $100 and told him "happy holidays".

Did your roofer build a cricket? If he just slapped sealant in the valley, it's a very temporary fix.



DAMHIKT!

[DaveS]

Did your roofer build a cricket? If he just slapped sealant in the valley, it's a very temporary fix.

Well, yes and no.

It already had a cricket. The problem was that the caulking (tar? whatever) at the top of the flashing let lose. I don't have a cap flashing (from your picture).

So, what was happening was:
(1) rain was coming down the chimney into the top of the flashing - not much
(2) snow was sliding down the steep slippery roof and collecting in that valley - higher than the flashing - and water was coming in during the melt (which happens often here in Pittsburgh).

It wasn't a lot of water.