California Closets!

[430752]

So this past labor day my wife and I went to one of her old college friends' bbq. She had recently moved into a nice, large home. Kind of a McMansion, but maybe not that big. Anyway, they've got money. Two things happened/observed, I dunno which is worse? (but the second is the tie-in to this forum):

1) I brought by two six packs of Hoegaarden beer. It was a BBQ, so you don't wanna show empty handed. the beer is a kinda fancy Belgian summer beer - I didn't want to show with a 12 pack of schlitz. We arrive, enter, and I give the host the beer. Nothing fancy, but it was the proper gesture I thought. So, he goes and says "Oh, we have a bartender". So, naturally, I ask whether I should give the bartender the beer. He says "no, we have a professional bartender with mixed drinks, several bottled beers, two draft beers, ...." I didn't know what to do! I left them on the kitchen counter, they were still there when we left. Go figure.

2) Okay, the tie in to this forum: taking a tour of the house the owners kept pointing out their various improvements and interior reduxes. One item was that it seemed every closet had "California Closets". And the Madam's office (separate from the Mister's office), had a California closet desk suite, meaning a desk, return, and big table all connected in a "U" shape, with wall cabinets and cornice type moldings. It was done in what looked like birch. They were quite proud. For those that don't know, California Closets is a mall-based store that sells nice-looking closet organiziing systems, being drawers, shelves, rods, etc. custom built for your closets, although it loks modular, very modern and sleek. Apparently they've branched out to offices and such.

I'd never paid much attention to California Closets, but we had a chance to view up close when my wife needed a private room to nurse the baby. Since I had nothing to do, I checked out the work. It was utter crap. Basically, its particle board or mdf with a vinyl wrap, I don't even think its a veneer. They screweed up the installation since where the return met the table, it was chipped and an attempt to patch was made, they read the dimensions of the window sill wrong and thus the thing didn't fit even close to the window sill it abutted (it was off by 4", and it wasn't by design!). The wall cabinets were'nt even/level to one another (only 1/16-1/8" off, maybe they didn't know, but I sure did!), and the cornice molding was both skewed and separated (e.g.: only in 4 ft. lengths, thus spliced, and not well done either since butt spliced and you saw a gap), the whole thing seemed a bit flimsy and it just sat on the ground, no feet or base.

Okay, I know I'm ranting, but I couldn't believe it! This stuff was terrible considering the (presumed) money spent and that they were hyping it up. Worse, as we were finishing, other people came on a self-guided tour (not with the owners) and one of the ladies said to the other four "oh, this is so nice, look, they've even got california closets desk stuff in here!" to which others in the group ohhhed and ahhhed and once said "That's so nice, I want california closets".

I guess my beef is that this stuff wasn't nice, its being passed off as nice, the populace no longer know what nice is, this takes work away from a regular guy who'd come out an do custom cabinets and do them right, and that this company is lowering our society's expectations while branding this name into the memory of every person who will now no longer expect quality nor bother to call a regular one-man-two man operation to get it done right.

okay, rant off.

curt j.

[Russianwolf]

I've show my wife the basics of what to look for in furniture. solid wood, good joinery, etc.

I've also told her that if she brings anything into the house that I wouldn't buy, I'm not touching it. I won't put it together, fix it, or even move it (unless it's in my way).

So far, she's only bought one chair that doesn't meet my standards, and it's "just for looks"

[os1kne]

Unfortunately, these days most people don't even know what features to look for to determine a quality product, so they don't recognize quality when they see it. If shown a slick sales pitch/brochure, many will believe that something is quality even though it is crap with a nice finish on it.

I cringe every time I go to the mall and see the crap that they sell at Pier One, Crate & Barrel, etc. I cringe harder when I see flocks of people oooing and aaahing over the stuff - ready to fork over hundreds of dollars for furniture that is made with veneered particleboard and assembled with butt joints, staples, and knock-down fasteners. (Fortunately my wife doesn't rave about their stuff anymore, she just gives me pictures from their catalog for future project ideas.)

Most people wouldn't even think of calling a local cabinet shop for a kitchen remodel, they'd just run to HD or Lowe's and place an order - not realizing that they'd probably get a much better kitchen for about the same amount of money.

It's sad that many true craftsmen are struggling to make a living, while total hacks are treated like they hung the moon for shoddy work installing a shoddy product.

Sorry about the rant.

[cabinetman]

This philosophy holds for most of the mass produced furniture sold in stores. To that, add HD & Lowes kitchen cabinets. For what the customer sees is just the outside, and to them it's all that matters. For years I've explained the differences to clients and why there is a difference in cost. In all my years in business, I never tried to compete price wise with that type of work. The build-to-fit theory seems too hard for the public to understand. They would rather see spacers and scribes as fillers. I forget what percentage of the market for kitchen cabinets are big box stores is like 60 - 65% I think. Believe it or not, GC's are still putting that junk in million dollar plus homes in South Florida.



"I'M NEVER WRONG - BUT I'M NOT ALWAYS RIGHT"

[bigsteel15]

My boss just renovated an 80s built home. Moved the kitchen from one side of the house to the other.
Anyways, they went with locally built custom cabinets of cherry. I was ooohhhing and aaaahhhing the drawers...all dovetailed joints, solid cherry fronts, solid doors. the only MDF/veneer was the cases. Goes very nice with the granite tops.
Also have cherry stair banisters with wrought iron.
All this goes nicely with the solid oak floors on the entire 2 top floors.

[mschrank]

You're a better man than me for keeping your thoughts to yourself. After the pompous remarks about the bartender (he should have accepted the beer with a genuine thanks), I would have been tempted to point out all the shortcomings in the furnishings.

[Russianwolf]

You're a better man than me for keeping your thoughts to yourself. After the pompous remarks about the bartender (he should have accepted the beer with a genuine thanks), I would have been tempted to point out all the shortcomings in the furnishings.

knowing my smartass attitude when dealing with uppity people, I would have yielded to temptation.

[asphalt-proof]

I'm not a craftsman by any means but I grew up around antique furniture and a father that appreciated fine workmanship. Your experience is just one more symptoms of rampant consumerism that most people seem to suffer from. Its just getting the latest greatest stuff nevermind the quality or where it came from.

Sorry for the rant. Shoddy workmanship is sad. People who thinks its the greatest thing are even sadder.

[Hellrazor]

knowing my smartass attitude when dealing with uppity people, I would have yielded to temptation.

I would have said something... " Oh look, is that a nose print on the ceiling?"

Being slightly impatient and hating arrogant/entitled people, I actually asked someone the following: "Did you ever get a brush burn walking around with your nose up in the air like that?". It was amusing for a few other people who didn't have the balls to say anything.

[Pappy]

I would not have made any comments on the quality of the furniture. Can't comment on something you didn't hang around long enough to see. Me and my beer would have been out of there.

[cbrown]

Most people wouldn't even think of calling a local cabinet shop for a kitchen remodel, they'd just run to HD or Lowe's and place an order - not realizing that they'd probably get a much better kitchen for about the same amount of money.

It's sad that many true craftsmen are struggling to make a living, while total hacks are treated like they hung the moon for shoddy work installing a shoddy product.

Sorry about the rant.

On the other hand, my experience has been that at least 7 out of 10 tradesmen (I'm not talking about cabinetmakers in particular) won't return calls, aren't interested in giving an estimate, etc., or otherwise offering the privilege of paying for their quality work--though I suppose your mileage with a McMansion may vary. At least the home centers will send out a used-car-salesman to quote a price and do a hard sell. Faced with those choices, I'd rather do it myself.

--Christopher

[JimD]

I think I may have my kids trained to know the difference. I moved darling daughter to her apartment at Clemson. She is a senior this year and wanted to move off campus. She needed a bedroom set for the apartment so I got to make a bed, end tables, and a dresser with mirror. I used some plans from an old Woodsmith magazine in my collection - they called it a bachlors chest plus related pieces. Like most of the Woodsmith furniture, it calls for machine made dovetails. I used solid maple with birch plywood panels and baltic birch plywood for the drawer sides. I changed the headboard plan to be a full bed frame with foot board and a couple maple rails. Nothing real fancy but not particle board either. Her roommates all had new furniture their parents probably spent a bunch more on than the materials in my daughters stuff. Mine is all dovetails and mortise and tenon and Jacqueline was around when a couple pieces were going together so I showed her the joints. I found a piece of figured maple in the pile of regular maple boards so some of the drawer fronts have some figure. They have all compared furniture now and announced Jacquelines stuff is nicest. I have not seen the other furniture but am glad the stuff I built was considered OK.

I have also looked at the closet stuff in the big box stores and decided to make my own when I rearranged my small walk-in. I just used melamine particle board but I made dovetailed drawers and don't have to worry about it falling apart.

Jim

[Jeffrey Schronce]

I was in a 1400 sq ft, $850,000 condo in Philly this week looking at some insurance related matter when one of the unit owners shows me their 100 sq ft walk in closet. $25,000 California Closets. There was some veneer, mostly cheaper Spanish Ceder, but it was entirely particle board as I had the pleasure of seeing the severe water damage it had experience due to a little water getting on it for a few hours.
I wanted to hit somebody. Probably him for buying them. Moron.
I am all for pissing away money if thats your thing, but get your moneys worth people!

[scorrpio]

The comment I'd make would be something like: These look nice, but custom-made solid wood ones would look so much better here... and cost about as much.

In many cases, they don't even know they paid all that cash for MDF.

[Anthony]

You're a better man than me for keeping your thoughts to yourself. After the pompous remarks about the bartender (he should have accepted the beer with a genuine thanks), I would have been tempted to point out all the shortcomings in the furnishings.

ditto.

and yes i have also seen california closet stuff.very humble stuff indeed.