Short rip fence

[eccentrictinkerer]

Has anyone had experience with this sort of jig?

It sort of goes against conventional wisdom of having a long fence to guide a board, but he makes a compelling case.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=d7QXIN2X8-w

[jackellis]

He does make a compelling case. However I would make one small change in his method, which is to position the short fence so the end furthest from the operator is about where the arbor is. Beyond that, the workpiece could be held against teeth up their upward trajectory. Set and forget instead of worrying about where to position the fence with each new piece of stock.

He does remind me that I need a low fence for ripping narrow pieces.

[cabinetman]

My opinion is that a short fence will allow long rips to take their own direction, which will affect what's happening at the point of the cut. It doesn't take much movement at the front end of the rip to affect the stocks proximity to the blade.

Binding can occur on either side of the cut stock.
.

[niki]

The "short fence" is part of the "anti-kickback system" that includes the short fence + riving knife.
That's the reason that the "anti-kickback pawls" are not mandatory in EU.

The riving knife itself will prevent the kick back in normal conditions but if the board that you are cutting bends toward the fence - because of internal stresses that are released after the cut - it may be pushed toward the blade and the rest, takes a split of second....

Nowadays, the short fence became a standard (by law) in all the EU table saws.
Not only, but the fence must have two positions, Low - for cutting shallow boards and High - for cutting thick boards.

The fence is adjustable and can be positioned as a short fence or as a full length fence.

Personally, I would use the short fence when I'm ripping a wide board (5~10") into two.

The fence is adjustable to "full length fence" for cutting Man made boards like Plywood, chipboard or MDF where there is no danger of internal stresses to be released.

I remember that SARGE had a post about the short fence...

Some pics of my TS and the fence

Regards
niki

[SARGE..g-47]

Totally.. totally.. totally agree with Niki and those in Europe that made a "short" fence mandatory that it is safer than a long fence. When you make a cut the stock is always.. always severed completely before the tail end of the stock reaches the highest tooth in the center of the arc on your TS blade. What is the point of having a fence beyond that point?

There is no point in reality but, there is a very valid point to not having the fence extend beyond that point. As NIki tioned, you will run into reaction wood that might close on the back of the blade. A splitter or riving knife is in place to prevent the stock from closing and pinching the back of the blade.

But... you do not eliminate the possibility of "kick-back" as many seem to live under the false illusion of with just a riving knife or splitter. If the stock spreads in "reaction" after it is severed and passes the blade, it can rebound on the long fence after the cut and come back toward the rear teeth and twist. As some of can tell you... if that reaction and rebound is strong enogh, the splitter or riving knife will not always stop it from touching as touch those rear risers is instant launch.

So.. a riving knife or splitter is only 1/6 of safety measures involved in what we can do to prevent kick-back. If you have the short fence working with a riving knife or splitter.. you have 3 or 1/2 of the safety measures in place with 3 more remaining. If the stock does get binded (and even with splitter and riving knife it can as a mere touch on those powerful rear rising teeth can lead to a violent reaction. The fence locked down is the 3rd safety measure as it Blocks movement right assuming you use the fence on the right side.

What if the stock catchs on the "dangerous" rear "rising"teeth and launches Upward. A riving knife-splitter and short fence cannot stop that. So.. some type of guard attached to the top of the riving knife-splitter is the 4rd piece of safety. But is still leaves us with 2 areas that can cause injury.

The fifth place stock can twist violently too in reaction to kick-back is the opposite side of the fence. Magnetic grippers.. feather-board or spring-board should be used on the open side to stop stock from making a complete turn and attacking the operator.

The fnal place the stock can be launched to is directly forward or rear-ward off the blade as many have probably personally seen. That's why the expression of "KEEP the LANE CLEAR" has been around for a zillion years. You should never intentionally stand in front or rear of the blade while it is still spinning.

I have used a home-made adjustable "short fence" for 7 years since being taught by Richard Jones who is an English instructor, authour and professional furniture maker. I made my own and have run over 200,000 linear feet of stock over a saw ripping. I run a "Crown guard" on top of the splitter and a spring-board to the left of blade. And BTW... the Uni-fence is a modified version of a short fence.

Regards..

[dlminehart]

Sarge, do you have a better picture of the spring board? Specifically, the end that contacts the wood being cut?

[SARGE..g-47]

Not availiable at this moment, DL. But.. the one on my router table may give you a closer look as it is made from simply from ply scrap with a couple of pieces of solid scrap. If it is not close up enough, I can get a better picture posted as soon as "foxy lady" gets home. I can take a picture, but she is the one I rely on to do whatever one does to get it into my computer. Duh...

Hope this helps, but let me know if you need it closer. Working on mortise and tenons for a chest of drawer face frame.. so will be up for coffee breaks every couple of hours and will monitor.

The one on the table saw is larger to accomodate wider. Other than that.. the principle is the same exactly. Just a solid piece of ply (solid for that matter. Then glue one thin strip on each forward outside edge. A piece of solid about 3/4" wide is glued to the separator strips.. Then you apply a thin separator strip to the front middle of the solid that has just been added.

The remaining forward solid strip is glued to that final separator. It will have spring at that point. I like to use poplar solid strips with scrap ply base. The separator shims or strips are poplar also. I find 3/4" to 1" on the middle strip and about 5/8"-3/4" for the outer to be my best bet. Smaller or larger would probably work fine. Round or arc the ends of the forward strip to allow ease of entry and exit. A square end can catch and tick you off. ha.. ha...

[MilDoc]

Sure do wish American (ie, Chinese) manufacturers would adopt some of the European standards, not just on table saws.

[ryanps]

Hey Sarge, Very impressive set-up. I am curious about your blade cover with the dust collection hose coming off of it. I just bought a dust collector and am also considering a Shark guard. But, is your unit one you fabricated yourself or one for purchase somewhere. Thanks!

Ryan

[SARGE..g-47]

Hey Sarge, Very impressive set-up. I am curious about your blade cover with the dust collection hose coming off of it. I just bought a dust collector and am also considering a Shark guard. But, is your unit one you fabricated yourself or one for purchase somewhere. Thanks!

Ryan

The Shark Guard is excellent, Ryan. My set-up is basically he same, just home-made with a few variations. The stock splitter was used as a template and my BIL (shift machine shop foreman Delta Air Lines) cut a new one using a thicker plate of .120. I drilled and added a Crown guard which is a piece of painted scrap hard-wood shaped on the band-saw.

The plastic shield is the stock shield from their Penn State Over-head Guard. They sell it separately on their site for $25. I modified it on my small BS to give it more arc in the front and rear to make it easier for stock to enter and exit. It raises as the rear is secured with a removable bolt and it pivots up and down on that.

I did cut some vertical slots in the splitter so that the Crown guard will raise and lower to stay closer to the blade whether you are cutting thin or thick stock. I also modified the two anchor bolts on my Uni-saw so a qucik spin of star handles will remove the whole kit and kaboodle very quickly. But.. you didn't ask about that so I will keep it a secret.

Any more questions.. feel free to ask. BTW.. my over-head guard is made from some old 1/2" pipe clamp bars I had on hand with a few L shaped 1/2" pipe fitting. The over-head collection is done with a 6 HP Shop Vac that sits under the right extention wing. The main port rear has been enlarged to accept the full 6" cyclone pipe I move from one large machine to another when needs. Quick connect attachments.

Hope that gives you some possible ideas....

[ryanps]

Thanks Sarge,
Appreciate the detailed explanation. I think I am going to go ahead an order a Shark Guard. I have declared 2008 the year of dust collection (for myself at least). I can't stand/believe the amount of dust created even from the simplest of cuts. Since I work in my garage everything gets covered.
Ryan

[jackellis]

Sarge, that spring board is a clever piece of engineering. I'd be curious to know what you think the advantages are compared with a more typical feather board other than its size. I'm also thinking one spring board can be mounted horizontally on the table to keep the stock against the fence and another can be mounted vertically on the fence to keep stock against the table, correct?

[SARGE..g-47]

The main advantage as I see it Jack, is I could build one eight feet long in a very short time without the repetitious cutting of individual feathers. Simplicity rules in my shop and my approach to building in general. Feathers takes some time and getting the correct thickness of an indivdual feather is not an easy task. I have a feather break for whatever reason sooner or latter and that may have something to do with cutting the angled feathers across grain.

I feel the spring-board keeps a consistent pressure on the entire length of the stock from entry to exit and litterally free of failure as it is made with only three basic components all cut with the grain. And the result is that stock also rides with the grain on the spring-board.

I have never used one vertical on the fence to resist stock coming UP. I use a Crown guard to counter any upward movement though an additional feather would not be a bad idea. But.. the height of most fences would limit how wide the 3 components are and the 3/16"-1/4" thick spacers would have to be considrered as a factor in getting over-all height.

Let me know if you try it as to the results.

[jackellis]

I've been thinking about how I'm going to build a short fence for both of my saws and realized they have another benefit. I often clamp a spacer to the fence so I can use it as a stop block for crosscuts (the block only extends to just in front of the blade). With a short fence, there's no need to do this since the "fence" now extends only as far as the point where blade teeth are falling towards the wood.

[SARGE..g-47]

I've been thinking about how I'm going to build a short fence for both of my saws and realized they have another benefit. I often clamp a spacer to the fence so I can use it as a stop block for crosscuts (the block only extends to just in front of the blade). With a short fence, there's no need to do this since the "fence" now extends only as far as the point where blade teeth are falling towards the wood.

Morning Jack...

That will work and I'm glad you pointed out that the stop has to not exceed an imaginary line drawn from it's forward tip to the front tip of the blade. One of the worst No-No's that someone can make is to try to use a stop beyond that point. That is asking for a major "kick-back" to happen and it wil.

My home-made fence has two quick release thumb screws on the reverse side you cannot see in those picutures as Niki's factory stock one's. The point is if you place different thickness stock on your saw and look to see where the tail of that stock is finally severed, you will see that the thinner the stock.. the closer to the front of the blade. 1" stock is usually about 4-5th tooth from front. 2" is about 6-7 tooth.. 2 1/2".. 3".. etc. gets progressivley closer to center tip.

But... no thickness your saw can handle will not be completely severed by the highest tooth which is center-line of the arc your blade travels on the saw. So.. the adjusters should be loosened and the fence extended no more than 1/2" past the final severing tooth depending on thickness of stock. And.. with the adjusters, it allows you to move and use the fence as a cross-cut stop block as you mentioned.

I don't personally use a stop on most occassions as I use the TS 95% to rip stock with a 12" SCMS doing all cross-cutting from fine to rough lumber cut down coming in my shop. I put extensions on my SCMS to telescope out allowing me to support and cut 16' stock. It telescopes in to a compact 4' and out to get the long stuff. I just roll it forward and open the outer door when I work with those lenghs.