Cope First?

[TB Roye]

Getting ready do make some Cope and Stick doors for some cabinet I am building for LOML.

Should I run the Cope on the rails before doing the Stick cuts on the rails and stiles? I am using Alder 2" wide 3/4" thick. I have a coping sled with backer block so I should be ok. I know when routing you are susposed to rout the end grain first. Don't want to mess these up fishing seson open the end of the month and I want these done.


Tom

[cabinetman]

Here's a pretty good tutorial.
http://www.finewoodworking.com/FWNPDFfree/011193042.pdf

.

[TB Roye]

Cabman

Thanks, that is exactly what I was looking for. The Rail and Stily bits shown (the red ones) are the one I am using. They are a set Freud bits my Nice's husband gave me 3 or 4 years ago. Printed it out so I can have it in shop to read.

Thanks again

Tom

[JimD]

If you make the backer piece this tutorial suggests is should be OK to stick last but I prefer to cut pieces to length and stick them first. Depending on the wood and your technique, you may find you do not need the backer piece (or you can use a simpler backer if you want to use one). I do not see any advantage of cutting the stick profile on long pieces, at least in my home shop. I get a better profile when I cut in one continuous motion and that is difficult to do on a long piece.

As far as experience, I've made one complete kitchen, with oak raised panel doors, and another kitchenette plus bathroom and other cabinets for two houses. I did not need to cope or stick in multiple passes, I always cut in one pass. My biggest router (an old Ryobi R-500) pulls 13.3A. I also successfully used my PC 690s for this. I've had zero problems with the strength of the joints with large floating raised panel doors (up to close to 2 feet wide). I finish the panels before glueing up raised panel doors so the panel was definitely glued to the frame.

I've also used all three types of cope and stick bits. I wouldn't buy a reversible again but I think either a stacked or a 2 bit set works fine. I have two router tables but I do not set up both for this and I thus like the advantage of only having to adjust height to switch from the cope to the stick cut. The sled I use for coping almost makes the height adjustment unnecessary. The key advantage I see to the 2 bit setup is you cut both profiles with the good face of the work down. That's easier to remember.

Jim

[TB Roye]

Having trouble with tear out on the cope but only on the end with the profile against the fence on the sled, even with the backer. I am going to try and cope the rails before I do the profile. I am using Alder and it seem to be very brittle. These are new Freud bits and have never been used. No trouble with the profile nice clean and sharp detail. I have plent of wood so I am going to try tomorrow and test cope a few rails before the profile and see it that helps.

Tom

[JimD]

Tom,

When you stick it cleans up at least a lot of the tearout of the coping. That's one of the reasons I usually cope first. Another thing to experiment a little with is speed of pushing the wood through. Faster = more tearout but too slow = burn.

I've never used alder but oak can be prone to splitting as are some softwoods I've used for painted doors. Coping first helps a lot. That plus a square backer should make it plenty minor enough it will disappear with the stick cut.

I've used maple and it is less prone to chip out than is oak. Maybe that is part of the reason the FWW author liked to stick first - the wood he was using was not a prone to chip out.

Jim

[TB Roye]

Jim

Got home this afternoon by taking care of 18 month old grandson. Did some testing using a backer and coping a sticked rail, still had tear out, tried with backer same, tried on opposite end with sticked side facing out no tear out with or without backer. tried on non stick rail no problem with our backer but much nice cut with backer. cur 16 new pieces of rail 8" long, and coped them using a backer kept fresh face on backer and now have 16 nice fitting rails with no tear out. I will stick them tomorrow morning. While doing these it all came back to me. Rout the end grain first. Now I haven't don much work in shop the past 4 years or so other than turning pens because of poor circulation the my legs and feet. Had surgery to repair a abdominal Aneurysm and while they were at it the repaird the Arteries in my leg and now I have decent circulation and am active again. So I was a little rusty taking on the project, so I had to redo a number of things but now everything looks good.

Once again every body on BT3 Central came through and helped me.

Thanks

Tom