Tour de France Rest Day News

[LarryG]

Although today is an off-day in Le Tour, I suppose the story at the link below is technically a spoiler. So if you don't want to know, don't click though, and don't come back to this thread.

http://www.velonews.com/tour2007/det...s/12910.0.html

[JR]

Pretty crazy.

[HarmsWay]

Very depressing. With his up/down performance in the last three days, I was giving him the benefit of the doubt. I thought he was just a really tough rider.

I didn't know of Vino's connection with Ferrari.

No more bad news please. Let the rest of tour test negative.

Bob

[atgcpaul]

Although today is an off-day in Le Tour, I suppose the story at the link below is technically a spoiler. So if you don't want to know, don't click though, and don't come back to this thread.

http://www.velonews.com/tour2007/det...s/12910.0.html

I always held his abilities in years past in high regard. That's really too bad. I
just don't get how they think they can get away with it.

[prlundberg]

These idiots are ruining one of the best sporting events in the world.

[Kristofor]

I
just don't get how they think they can get away with it.

That's just it, they keep getting busted which to means that they think they CAN get away with it most of the time, which in turn leads me to believe that many more people ARE getting away with it at least for a while.

If every cycler who doped was busted on their first race while using, it seems like that would clean the sport up in a hurry, there would be no incentive to cheat. For so many to keep cheating must mean that it works and isn't caught a significant portion of the time...

Kristofor.

[JR]

. For so many to keep cheating must mean that it works and isn't caught a significant portion of the time...

Absolutely correct, IMO. It's pretty hard for the scientists to make dope-finding tests available, because athletes move on to new drugs so fast, sometimes befrore the they come to market! Procrit (a form of EPO) was being used by cyclists while it was still in clinical trials. It's pretty hard to make a detection test prior to the drug actually being available...

Up to now the pressure has been entirely on the athlete. With a view to getting serious about banning drugs, teams are now hurt when an athlete tests positive. Vinokurov's team has now left the TdF, including Andreas Kloden, who sits in fifthe place with a very credible chance to move onto the podium (3rd or better). And with one week of the world's biggest bike race left, that's a lot of lost tv time for Astana, the sponsor.

There still needs to be a way to sanction team management. In some cases it's clear that team doctors, under management orders, are supplying and/or administering drugs. There are laws coming on the books in some countries, making it illegal to supply drugs in this fashion, but it's still hard to catch them. The rules of cycling also need to make sure to ban these critters.

JR

[HarmsWay]

Vinokurov's team has now left the TdF, including Andreas Kloden, who sits in fifthe place with a very credible chance to move onto the podium (3rd or better). And with one week of the world's biggest bike race left, that's a lot of lost tv time for Astana, the sponsor.
JR

Astana had just announced yesterday, I believe, that they were extending sponsorship to cover the next ten years. I guess they'll take that back now.

Bob

[JR]

Astana had just announced yesterday, I believe, that they were extending sponsorship to cover the next ten years. I guess they'll take that back now.

Hard to say. The team sponsorship is comprised of public money from the government of Kazakhstan, plus some commercial entities in that country. They have a number of outstanding young Kazakh riders.

They may want to continue the exposure for their small country. As they say in public relations, "There's no such thing as bad press".

JR

[HarmsWay]

With government money, unless the doping is disputed, I would say they'd pull out. I thought they were sponsored by the national railway. Maybe I'm thinking of another team.

I don't think "cheater! cheater!" is good press. They may regroup under a different name. Astana seems to be a very good name for a group of mostly Kasakh riders though. So maybe you're right. Maybe they'll just say "We're back and we got rid of the one bad apple."

Bob

[JR]

"We're back and we got rid of the one bad apple."

Pluse the two others who got busted last month.

[HarmsWay]

Pluse the two others who got busted last month.

Ouch! I didn't know that. Were they Kasakh?

Bob

[JR]

An Italian and a German.

Astana has sort of winked at the doping implications of their riders. They were excluded from the TdF last year when Spanish investigators implicated four of their riders in doping. They didn't have a quorum after that.

It this point, though, with extra scrutiny by the UCI, the TdF organizers, and public at large, the teams don't have much wiggle room. Some teams have fired riders who were implicated in the past. Others have started internal, team-sponsored, testing which has resulted in riders losing their jobs.

And some managers are now affected. Astana had a manager suspended a few weeks ago, because he was the manager for Telekom in '96 and six of those guys came out and admitted doping that year. Also two team physicians from that team, now employed at the University at Fribourg, have been sacked.

It's going to be a long journey to cleanliness.

JR

[LarryG]

Stepping back a bit, I like the opening comments made by Al Trautwig on this morning's TdF pre-race show. He said, loosely, "Baseball's home run record is about to be broken by a known steroid abuser. One of the NFL's biggest stars has been indicted for raising dogs to kill each other. An NBA ref has admitted to fixing games. A top PGA pro says there may be steriod use on the tour so golfers can keep up with Tiger Woods. And now, in this Tour de France ..."

Cycling isn't the only sport with a rotten core (although, to be fair, the Vick situation doesn't directly involve football). It's just the one that's been getting most of the bad press.

[prlundberg]

Stepping back a bit, I like the opening comments made by Al Trautwig on this morning's TdF pre-race show. He said, loosely, "Baseball's home run record is about to be broken by a known steroid abuser. One of the NFL's biggest stars has been indicted for raising dogs to kill each other. An NBA ref has admitted to fixing games. A top PGA pro says there may be steriod use on the tour so golfers can keep up with Tiger Woods. And now, in this Tour de France ..."

Cycling isn't the only sport with a rotten core (although, to be fair, the Vick situation doesn't directly involve football). It's just the one that's been getting most of the bad press.

Yep. Even though cycling has the toughest pelanties and the most stringent testing.

On the other hand, endurance athletes often have the most to gain by cheating. Every little advantage makes a significant difference over the course the TDF. Supposedly this is what made Lance great, his attention to detail in training, bike, apparel, etc. But his accomplishments will be forever tainted because the entire sport is.

I don't understand steriod use in golf. Many of them look like they've never seen a gym, and although Tiger is fit I wouldn't consider him top athlete from a physical standpoint.