Building codes

[Ed62]

I have a son who is going to build a small house on property he owns. He wanted to get information on building codes, and he was told that he didn't have to follow any codes if he did the work himself. I told him he'd better check into that a little deeper. He called the State of Indiana. They told him the same thing, as long as he doesn't build in an area that is corporated. Wouldn't you think that he'd at the very least be bound by the National Electrical Code? Just doesn't sound right to me. Of course he's smart enough to do things right.

Ed

[LinuxRandal]

When my brother built his house in an unincorporated area, outside of a town, he was told your allowed to build a structure, per so many acre's without building permits/inspections, codes etc. However, to insure it, it should be up to codes. That said, after that, they required county inspections for other buildings (although they ignore them for storage/unwired barns).

Now towards the end, they were trying to get that changed (income for the local) and he had the local electrical inspectors come out (for his own piece of mind, he hates electricity, long story). They failed in my book! They didn't know the first thing about network/phone wiring and it's required insulation for open spaces.

[whitecobra]

Codes require enforcement
Since MOST areas have no enforcement/inspections for home owner renovations there is no need for codes to be listed

HOWEVER your home DOES have another area that is important and that is your home owners insurance. If a claim is made and the "fault" is determined to be your son's lack of appropriate work product they will not pay

You can liken this to speed limits on private roads. If you own the road (and it is big enough) you can ostensibly set the limit or not. Since there is no one to enforce it and since you designate the road as private the police will need a warrant to enter the road you don't' need to hassle with limits

Dr D

[movnup]

That doesn't pass the smell test ... is the house being built in the country in an unincorporated area??? Even if he could build the house I would check with insurance companies as to making sure that a DYI home witout permits was insurable to its full replacement value. A permit also states a value on improvement on it which the downside is they use for new taxes but also it has an upside in that it creates a true monetary number that validates and usually increases the value of the property when it is sold.

I live in the city of Bellevue WA which has some pretty strict rules and many well to do people living in it e.g. Bill Gates and it took me six tries just to get a dang permit for a double decker deck. There are horror stories around here of where people didn't get the permit or the right type of permit and when the house was sold they had to tear it all out. One that comes quickly to mind was a $100k mountain / lake view addition down the road from me that a DYI guy worked on for four years where it was ordered torn down by the code police and was a very harsh /expensive lesson.

A website to look at is www.buildingpermit.com ....

Clarification: In order to get a permit you must coply with the building codes. The website I mentioned has downloadable printouts of codes, compliant drawings, and specifications for submisssion. Sorry about the confusion ...

[Tom Slick]

It sounds to me like someone is confusing "codes" with "permits".

In my area it doesn't make any difference who does the work, if the job requires a permit then it requires a permit period.

[jackellis]

I know almost nothing about building codes but I can think of a couple of good reasons to make sure he builds to *some* local code:

1) Insurance

2) Fire and electrical safety

3) Easier to build it right than to fix it later.

These may not apply in Indiana but a couple of the things they require here that I would do even if I did not have to build to code:

GFCI electrical sockets in bathrooms and the kitchen.

Certain number of electrical outlets for every X linear feet of wall. Actually, I'd put in quads instead of doubles because we have so much stuff to plug in these days.

Galvanized steel brackets at critical points in the building frame for earthquake resistance (I know some of the terminology is wrong).

Lights underneath kitchen cabinets that are above countertops

Sill plates bolted to the foundation for seismic protection

Minimum area for eave vents to keep the attic properly ventilated.

Minimum amount of wall and ceiling insulation

If he's going to spend a lot of time in this house, he ought to do all he can to make it energy efficient. Extra insulation, dual pane windows, proper attic ventilation,floor insulation if he's got a crawl space, wrap the pipes, consider a tankless water heater instead of a more traditional type. Heating costs are headed in one direction and it is very costly to retrofit windows and insulation after the house is built compared with doing all this stuff as the house is being built.

[scorrpio]

You forget utilities.
Gas company would not connect me to gas without seeing inspection stickers on my gas piping and my boiler install.

I am sure electrical company will NOT turn on power without inspector's approval on the wiring.

Water/sewer connection requires plumbing inspection.

And so on.
So if he plans to run his own generator, heat with firewood, get water from a well and dispose into a septic tank (btw, a pumping company might refuse to pump a tank that's not to spec). He can go right ahead.

Sorta like you don't NEED to have a car insured, inspected or registered - you can drive around your backyard all you want, but forget about using public roads.

[LarryG]

I make my living dealing with building codes. Things vary from state to state and from locale to locale, but technically, what your son was told may well be right. If a structure isn't located within the fire district or a police jurisdiction, no permit may be required and if there's no permit, there's no inspections, and if there are no inspections, codes are moot.

That said, the points about being able to insure the building should be taken into account.

Also, for light frame construction (i.e., a typical residence), the building codes are pretty minimal and non-invasive. Any house that was built so it didn't comply with these sections of the codes would be very shoddy, very substandard construction.

Other portions of the code boil down to just good common sense practices. For example, the section of the building codes that deal with stairway construction -- riser and tread sizes, handrail locations, etc -- are based on the real-world needs and body proportions of the human occupants. A stairway that strayed too far from typical code requirements would be uncomfortable at best and dangerous at worst -- and who would choose either of those? Similarly, the electrical code is mainly about safety. Who would deliberately want to wire a house in an unsafe manner?

Bottom line, the building codes for residential construction are basically so simple and "automatic" in good, sound construction that failing to comply with them would make the building of a structure a waste of time and materials. It's so easy to comply that there's really no reason not to do it.

[ironhat]

Until 2 or 3 years ago there were no wide ranging codes here in PA except for utilities. Building codes, such as an inspected footer depth, were not. Truely, the inspection process can be a frustrating pain but in the long haul it's less expensive to pay for inspections than to sue a contractor for substandard construction. I've only had to do it for the double-wide cabin which only required utility and footer inspections, so it was far cheaper than stick-built inspection process.
Later,
Chiz

[scorrpio]

IWho would deliberately want to wire a house in an unsafe manner?

Deliberately? Probably unlikely. But I frequent home inspection forums, and you'd be amazed at how many insanely unsafe things are done due to lack of knowledge and/or desire to save a buck. Inspectors tend to take and post pictures. I've seen:

Plugged shut pressure relief valves (cause it was leaking)
Wire in panel clamped to main live bus by a binder clip (breaker went bad, owner never got around to buying a new one)
Floor joist with a 4" deep notch near center to accomodate a toilet drainpipe.
And many more.

[Russianwolf]

The state of WV doesn't have building codes. Each city can set their own and most use the stardard (forget what it's called). But if you don't live in a city/town then you can do whatever you please.

Now if you build a bad house and someone visits and gets hurt, they'll sue you. Whether or not the insurance company will honor the claim is your problem, so building to code is smart.

[WoodTherapist]

LarryG summed it up very well. Additionally, you didn't say what county your son is located in, but he should check with county government to confirm what is or is not required. Some counties in Indiana require permits (and code adherance), some don't. Here is the link to State of Indiana building code requirements: http://www.state.in.us/legislative/iac/title675.html which counties and municipalities can choose to enforce or not. Nonetheless, as stated by others, it would be short-sighted to not comply. Additionally, the codes can be a great resource if he is not certain what to do in a specific situation.

[Ed62]

Wow! I sure didn't expect all those replies. There is no permit required, and no building codes to be enforced. I am pretty well aware of building codes in my area (which is not where he's located), so there will be no problem doing the job properly. My oldest son is a licensed electrician, and he'll be doing the electrical work (again, no problem).

There were a couple of posts that brought up things I hadn't considered, i.e. insurance. There will not be a problem whatsoever for him, but it just didn't sound right to me that people would be allowed to build anything they wanted without codes. I can visualize people building places that are very unsafe to anyone around the structures.

Ed