Japan finishing? (Hank?)

[RodKirby]

Wasn't quite sure where to post this...

LOML brought this back from her Japan trip - quite small - about 6" wide.

I could easily make lots of these, BUT - how do they do this laquer thing?

It's like it's been "dipped" - too thick/even to be sprayed.

[sparkeyjames]

Your wifely unit brought back a wood product from Japan? I would be insensed. Here you have a man with a fully functional wood shop at your disposal and you buy a wood product. It's it's like slap in the face. The least she could have done is given you a chance. Take a pic ask you to build it and if you then failed to deliver order it online.
By the way the desired effect can consist of many coats of laquer. Then polish it till it gleams. Or there are types of powder coat that can be used on wood. It's just that the underlying wood construction has to be a hardwood and it and the glue used must be able to withstand the heat of the curing process of the powder coat.


Sparkeyjames.

[RodKirby]

Thanks - powder coating just "sounds right"

[leehljp]

Most of the folks that make those things spend several years in training as apprentices to perfect the lacquer application. It also takes a special kind of lacquers that are hard to get outside of Japan. When these lacquers are available, they are VERY expensive.

So, they start with preparing the wood meticulously, somewhat like a fellow on this forum keeps his shop meticulously clean and who makes meticulously sharp and beautiful jigs. "Meticulously" is the operative word here!

They put a special formulated base coat and sand and sand and sand and apply a several more coats of base coat. Lots of time between coats for curing.

Then they use a special formulated, high quality expensive lacquer. Sanding with very fine sandpaper between coats. Lots of time between coats for curing.

High quality Japanese lacquerware takes months in the making, but lots of time is used for curing and waiting - but actually working on other pieces while other are curing.

AND I gave the simplified version.

There are clear coats that some use over pigmented lacquers for faster production that give it a wet look, and to the untrained eye - are very similar to the expensive lacquerwares. These are less expensive but still look nice.

[Stytooner]

Lacquer can be easy when sprayed, but can easily screw up too. Conditions of air and curing need to stay within the range stated by the manufacturer. As Hank stated, good lacquer can be very expensive.
There are a lot of wood products now that are using powder coating as a finish.
I cure my parts at 400 degrees F for 20 minutes. I could cure at 425 for 15 minutes. Thats a little high for wood unless you are making charcoal. The slow cure range is still 250 for about 45 minutes. They have new formula's of PC that can cure at less than 200 degrees. I am not certain of the costs of powders or equipment for low temp cure powders. They also have powders that can fully cure under UV lights.
I receive a finishing trade journal that has articles on new techniques and finishes for manufacturing and it always amazes me what they will come up with next.
Costly? To be sure, but dang inventive.
The best part of most PC systems is very low emissions and environmental impact and generally a longer lasting and tougher product.

I can't count the times I have been high from spraying lacquer. Even with a respirator, it can still sneak up on you. Not good anytime, much less around wood working equipment .
I still use lacquer for some things, but for the most part, I'll leave that to the Masters.

[DonHo]

But will the lacquer look "right" on MDF

DonHo

[downtheroad]

Polyester is one of the "factory" finishes that have this high build. You can see it on many of the new pianos on the market today. It is very toxic and not very easy to use in a non-industrial environment.

Our shop achieves good results with water-based polyurethane primers, sanding sealers, solid colors , and clears.

We first prep the surface by filling with putty any dents, nail holes, etc.

Then we sand up to 180 - 220 grit (make sure to lightly round over sharp corners)

This is then sprayed with primer and sanded with 280 - 320 grit and checked to see if any more putty is needed to repair any missed areas

We usually will need to spray/sand another coat of primer (or more) until we get a nice surface without any orange peel texture

Then we apply color coats, usually 2 or more which is sanded with 320 - 400 grit after each coat

When everything looks good, we will spray 2-4 coats of clear topcoat knocking down between coats any dust nibs or defects if any with the finest grit that will get the job done

We try to spray a perfect final coat that won't need any defect sanding but if any is needed we take care of that before we wet-sand with 600 - 800 - 1000 - 1500 grit, then we polish with automotive compounds to get that perfect paint job.

Tony

[TheRic]

But will the lacquer look "right" on MDF

DonHo

Powder Coating will!!!!

[RodKirby]

Thanks everyone