Stupid HOA or "I fought the law and the law won"

[atgcpaul]

Sorry, no real message. Just a pseudo-rant.

I got a second notice from our HOA about my woodworking.
The first notice a year ago I was able to deflect pretty
easily. I was friendly with 4 out of the 5 board members
as well as the property management company. The anonymous
complainer(s) was "concerned" I was running a business out
of my garage and cited some noise concerns. With a phone
call and a letter, I assured them I was not running a
business (I'm not) and that it was for home improvement and
that I abide by the quiet hour policies.

Well, one year later, 2 of the board members were ousted
in an election and so I'm outnumbered 3 to 2 and we got a
new management company that is a stickler for the rules. I
realize rules exist for a reason, but come on. This letter
actually cites the CC&Rs and says I'm in violation of having
an unapproved "hobby shop". They basically want me to get
rid of my shop permanently.

I guess they got me there. There's no way this board is
going to approve my activities even though I've drastically
dialed back shop time--mainly because most of the home
improvement stuff is done--no really. I'm surprised I didn't
get a letter 2 years ago, go figure. I think I would have
even said something back then. I think while I was in the
act, they actually called one of the board members to come
listen outside my garage.

(Un)fortunately, I'm taking WWing classes at a local place
so I can work there, but it gets crowded and crazy. That's
why I have my own shop. I guess I'll be spending more time
at school.

This whole situation wouldn't be so bad if my neighbors
actually had the *alls to say this to my face. I'd like
to explain to them that my activities are so I can improve
my house and get a good price when I sell, thus affecting the
value of their houses. We are actually putting the house
on the market next week so I can't wait to get out.

HOA rules are funny, though. I am allowed to vacuum my
house until 10pm. Guess who's vacuuming at 9:30pm with the
windows open?

Thanks for reading,
Paul (argh!!!!)


PS--I have considered just ignoring this and continue to use
my tools--when absolutely need, of course--however, since
some of the realty transactions have to go through the
management company, I don't want to somehow get screwed out
of my home sale.

[Warren]

Southern California is a nice place to visit but, I'll stick with Alaska, 2.5 acres, distant neighbors and no home owners association. The neighbors mind their own business, unless someone needs help, and I do the same.

[final_t]

Get even

Start filing complants about your neighbors. Loud music, tv, questionable activities, late comings and goings. Sure that lady next door isn't doing tax returns out of her kitchen? The guy down the road sure looks shifty and gets a LOT of packages... be creative. Revenge is a dish best served up fresh.

[SillyGoose]

Do you keep your garage door shut or open? If it is shut I doubt they can really hear that much unless they are trying. Is your shop any louder than a lawnmower or weedwhacker?

Ask them what the decible requirement is. Then test the sound with the shop running from your nearest neighbors property and see if it is louder than the alloted decibles.

Do you have a restriction about hobby shops in your covenant?

I would at least show up at the HOA meeting and state that you are fixing up your place to be sold and ask if you can have a variance for the home improvements. If they think they are getting rid of you soon they might just leave it alone

[maxparot]

When I went shopping for a different home 3 years ago, I told the realtor NO HOA! It really shortened the number of listing to go look at. Bottom line is I don't like being one of the clones. No one is going to tell me what I can use my property for or do to my property. When I tell others of my choice I'm warned about night mare neighbors. My answer is if they don't like me they can move.

[Derrick]

How about a pink house with chartreuse trimmming. Is there any rule on paint colors? Sorry, but I have seen that done before and it really does upset the HOA.

[JR]

Paul,

I'm pretty sure you've got the right attitude - frustrated, but resigned. You absolutely can not mount a successful fight against a hostile HOA. They are more powerful than any municipality, because they can likely take your house as a last resort.

Run, don't walk, to your realtor and get the heck out of Dodge!

JR

[John Hunter]

I simply do not do HOA's I turned down 3 different houses that were involved in them when I was buying.

[crokett]

I sorta know the feeling. Several years ago I was traveling from NY to NC and stopped to visit my uncle in NJ for the weekend. I helped him take down a tree that the city wanted him to take down because it was dead and a danger to traffic, etc. We took it down and cut it smaller, then he had somebody come in to grind the stump, take away the big stuff and chip the little stuff.

He used that and the stump chips for mulch. Then we cut some sod from the backyard where he was going to put a shed and planted it where the tree used to be out front - this was all over 1.5 days one summer. So no mess (tree gone, sod down, etc) and no fuss. He came for Thanksgiving and said he got in trouble with the HOA for cutting down the tree without authorization. Improper alteration of property or somesuch. He sent them the letter from the city, didn't fix the issue. He ended up having to get the city attorney's office involved.

[bigfoot15]

Paul,
You absolutely can not mount a successful fight against a hostile HOA. They are more powerful than any municipality, because they can likely take your house as a last resort.

JR

Seriously?


What the heck is the point of an HOA?
I first started reading and though you lived in a condo complex.
I guess one would run into the same thing buying in a controlled subdivision eh?
that is one thing I've told LOML we will not be doing.

[JR]

Seriously?
What the heck is the point of an HOA?

Yes, seriously. Of course, it depends on the specific codes, covenants, and restrictions (CC&Rs).

The purpose is to assure a minimum standard of decorum is observed and to administer maintenance of common areas. Some right-thinking HOAs just administer the tree maintenance and pool cleaning and leave it at that.

Others have very restrictive CC&Rs identifying appropriate shades of house color, the number and types of vehicles allowed, what you can keep in your garage - they can be very intrusive. In so doing it is thougjt that the investment is protected against unwanted or unsightly variations. That pink house with chartreuse trim would never appear in any self-respecting California HOA.

The remedies available to most HOAs to rectify any violations would make the average citizen scream. The can paint your pink house and charge you. They can mow your lawn and charge you. They can seize your house - literally.

I know we are all admonished to read any contract we sign. If you're looking at a home with a HOA, you absolutely need to read and understand every word of the CC&Rs. It can be a frightening experience.

I sold my condo, at which I was an association board member, in 1986 and have never been in a HOA since then. And that was a friendly and benign association! I coulnd't imagine being in one of these modern seas of sameness. It reminds me of Eugene Zamyatin's "We", oh but now I really digress.

JR

[Pappy]

One neighbor brought the idea of an HOA up a few years after I bought my place. (1/4 mile culdesac with 16 homes, all on 1+ acres) I told her to go for it and she was delighted with the support for her idea. Then I finished...since it wasn't in place when I bought, I would neither participate nor abide its rules.

[Russianwolf]

I would ask for specific code violations. Read the wording and follow it to the letter. If it says no business, then no business (but a hobby shop isn't a business). Is there a specific code that says no hobby shops or that they must be approved? ask if this is a blanket rule that no home improvements are allowed.

I have yet to receive a copy of the covenents from my HOA even though I have requested them 3 times. And they hold the HOA meetings during times I have no hope of attending. I've mentioned this to both presidents, but have't gotten anywhere on scheduling these things at more commuter friendly times.

I know that they have one that says something about derilect vehicles. I can't wait for them to see my Rusty old Jeep in the driveway. (It's insured and will be registered next week).

[Stick]

I'm with Warren........on my 160 acres of owned land and 640 rented, I can do whatever the h-e-double hockey sticks I want to, including any business I feel like running, any number of vehicles I feel like owning, anything I care to do to my house or buildings, any animals I want to keep, crops I want to grow, etc. My nearest neighbours are over 4 miles away, and they could care less what I do as long I stay out of their fields. They come to me all the time to get stuff made since I have a machine shop. The one and only time a neighbour ever even mentioned noise was when I had a friends pulling truck running (500 inch Donovan making over 2000hp) and one came over to see what I was working on. Said he'd heard it from 6 miles away. Wasn't at all angry, just curious. Even brought beer.

I cannot even imagine living somewhere with rules like you're talking about.

[BobSch]

No way in heck I'd by any property that had a HOA. No how, No way.

If I'm breaking the law then someone can call the cops, but having a bunch of tight-butted "neighbors" telling me what to do? Not in this lifetime!