Neither a lender nor borrower be?

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  • Neither a lender nor borrower be?

    I went out to the garage today and couldn't find my wheel barrow. It is at one of my kids houses. My Ridgid sander is at another kids house, framing and strapping nailers, pry bar, ladder, and some other misc tools are at a neighbor's and my sledge hammer was by my front door yesterday after being returned from another neighbor.

    Do you lend out your tools?
    13
    No, never, I'm nice but not crazy.
    15.38%
    2
    Sometimes but only to a few selected individuals
    61.54%
    8
    Yeah, to pretty much anyone.
    23.08%
    3

    The poll is expired.

    Chr's
    __________
    An ethical man knows the right thing to do.
    A moral man does it.

  • #2
    One neighbor borrowed a hand saw and left it out in the rain. His reaction was, "oh well". The saw was heavily corroded and the wood handle damaged. That put him on the blacklist.
    I borrowed a friend's cordless drill many years ago. The variable speed trigger failed while I was using it. (No abuse to the tool, it was unlucky timing). I diagnosed the issue, ordered the replacement part, and repaired the tool so I returned it better than I received it.

    Comment


    • atgcpaul
      atgcpaul commented
      Editing a comment
      "Oh, well" was his response? Man, some people!

  • #3
    When I know someone well enough as to their care for tools or lack of care - that determines if I will or won't.

    BTW, I am the same way with who I work with. Two of my daughters have 4 sons each. LOML and my daughters want my grandsons to work with me on lots of projects. I will NOT. This past weekend, for my middle daughter, I cut down a 3 foot diameter ash tree (Green borer) with a 1ft diameter limb over my daughter's house. They wanted me to use one of my grandsons who happened to be nearby. No Way. I made them mad.

    When I have only one day to do that, and it has to be finessed, I don't have time for those who want a goody goody family feeling in a dangerous work, and I need a helper who is attentive at ALL times. Instinct and experience are a necessity when using chain saws, pulleys and ropes with a 1000 lb limb over a house! You don't learn that in a 5 minute talk. And as much as I love all of my grandsons, I know their personality and in what areas they can work well . The one in question is one who loves to talk and talk and talk. He gets bored with physical labor real quick. I can't concentrate when carrying on a casual conversation. His younger brother is a whiz with tools and figuring out problems like this, but he was a couple of hundred miles away,

    Back to tools, One relative had a leaky pipe under his house. I loaned him my blower to dry it out after he had the pipe fixed. 6 months later I asked for the blower back. "Well, it doesn't work anymore. I left it out in the rain and it doesn't work anymore." Me: "Give it back and I will see if I can get it working again!" Him: "Well, it wouldn't work so I threw it away." Me: "Do you know how much those things cost?" Him: No, does it matter? Me: $100 (9 or 10 years ago). It matters to me.

    He has not asked for any more tools and acted like I insulted him. I will say that he has one son that I will loan tools to. That son knows the value of tools and the quality of tools, and he takes care of them - mine and his.
    Last edited by leehljp; 08-11-2022, 07:44 AM.
    Hank Lee

    Experience is what you get when you don't get what you wanted!

    Comment


    • #4
      When I borrow a tool, I try and return it in better shape than it was received in.
      Put some gas in it. Clean and oil. Tighten loose screws and replace broken or missing parts if possible
      Loring in Katy, TX USA
      If your only tool is a hammer, you tend to treat all problems as if they were nails.
      BT3 FAQ - https://www.sawdustzone.org/forum/di...sked-questions

      Comment


      • #5
        One thing that I never loan out is my pressure washer. I have loaned them out in the past and it always seems that they don’t produce the pressure they use to. After my 4th pressure washer gave up the ghost I finally learned the problem. This problem may not apply to everyone. If your house is on a well you never ever connect the pressure washer to the well supply water, connect the hose to a house hose bib somewhere away from the well. It seems that when creating a lot of pressure the pressure washer pump is susceptible to entraped air which a well is known for. Several gasps of this air and the pump is toast. Neighbor #1 always hooked the washer straight to the well pump hose bib because it provided lots of high pressure water.
        A neighbor borrowed my battery powered drill to do drywall work where he had to tear out a bathroom wall to access piping and valves. He returned it 6 years later when he found the drill that had fallen into the wall cavity he was closing up. DeWalt had changed from 14.4 to 18 volt so this drill was useless.

        Comment


        • #6
          I used to, but that has passed.

          Not too long after I married (1967), my FIL gave me a Craftsman router for a Christmas present. At that point I had no experience with routers. I had shown it to my father because that was probably one of the few tools he didn't own. A few months later he asked if he could borrow it as he was remodeling their kitchen. Of course I would gladly do anything for him. But several months later I had a project that I could use the router on. Knowing that he was through with his project, I asked if I could have the router back and after two or three ignored requests, I drove out there to get it. He seemed a bit miffed about it and when I got it home, I found the baseplate all gouged up, and two of the bits broken. Dad always took pretty good care of his tools and of course in my teen years I often was tasked with their cleaning and maintenance, which I enjoyed. While I didn't understand why my router was so abused, I never asked him about it and as time passed and my own tool arsenal increased I happily shared my interest with him, but he never asked to borrow any tool ever again, making a comment about the router.

          Since that time, I've had a few bad experiences with others. I once lent my best friend my belt sander, with several brand-new belts; three months later I had to go get it, as he didn't return it after a couple of requests. The belts were gone (never to be replaced) and the thing was clogged with dust, and the rollers corroded because he just left it in his damp basement sitting on the floor.

          Another good friend borrowed my Sears shop vac. Again, several inquiries as to whether he "was done yet" and always an excuse. Two months later I went down to his office and found the vac full of murky, smelly water. The filter was moldy and disintigrading and the metal motor cover rusted to the point of perforation in a couple of places.

          Right after we moved here, my new neighbor asked if we had a ladder she could use for a day or two because she wanted to paint her kid's bedroom ceiling. Sure! Well I got it back a few days later, but it was splattered with paint, drippings down the leg and splotches on the steps. Guess she didn't own a cleaning rag!

          Since then, I'm very reluctant to loan anything to anybody. I have given away a few tools though, if I have an extra... it's a lot less hassle!

          I've also learned that if a friend or relative want to borrow, you also have to ask if they know how to use the tool. Makes me nervous because there's always the concern that the borrower is going to hurt themselves. So, if anyone needs that kind of help, go a step further and just take your tool there and help them out.


          CWS.
          Think it Through Before You Do!

          Comment


          • #7
            My Grandfather often said that if you borrow someone's tools, you must return them in better condition than when you borrowed them. I have an old cheap B&D circular saw that was one of my first power tools. Next door neighbor was starting a tile business and asked to borrow it to cut forms. Two years later, I needed the saw and asked him if he was done with it. He got this ashen expression on his face and went over to his truck. He came back with the orange saw completely covered in concrete/grout dust. Turned out his crew had been sawing concrete and tile with it for the last two years. He apologized profusely and offered to buy me a new saw. I told him I'd take a look at it and let him know. I tore the saw down, re-packed the gear case, and put it back together. It ran fine and still does today some 30 years later. Bet a $30 saw today wouldn't.
            Jim Frye
            The Nut in the Cellar.
            ”Sawdust Is Man Glitter”

            Comment


            • #8
              I loaned a chain saw to a good friend of my eldest son for a "few weeks" until he could buy his own. When I got it back 6 months later it cost close to $100 to get it fixed and running again. He is banned from my property. One neighbor and I borrow back and forth a lot. Other than him and my sons, nope!

              Can someone come iin my shop and work? Not in this lifetime. Beginners get hurt by spinning thing and blood is corrosive and you ain't bleeding on my tools!
              Don, aka Pappy,

              Wise men talk because they have something to say,
              Fools because they have to say something.
              Plato

              Comment


              • twistsol
                twistsol commented
                Editing a comment
                Originally posted by Pappy View Post
                Can someone come in my shop and work?
                I hosted the high school robotics team in my shop for a number of years until we moved. Even with a couple of other seasoned woodworkers in the shop assisting, my stress level was off the charts.

            • #9
              Ah spinning things in the shop. I took wood shop in Jr. High and the teacher forebade us from using the tablesaw. He maintained that we were too careless. Then he dropped my project on the un shrouded spinning blade launching it across the shop into a wall.
              Jim Frye
              The Nut in the Cellar.
              ”Sawdust Is Man Glitter”

              Comment


              • #10
                I rember my shop classes well. Three years of metal shop and my final year in wood. No accidents though, at least not one that caused anyone to bleed, some close calls though. The wood shop was the best though as we did no personal projects, manufactured 70-some desk the first semester and fabricated a small house the 2nd. Great learning experience.

                CWS
                Think it Through Before You Do!

                Comment


                • capncarl
                  capncarl commented
                  Editing a comment
                  CWS, your shop class post reminded me of something that I read about some time ago. I believe this was for a senior woodworking class, with several classes participating. The shop class took orders for desks and the whole class participated in building them as if they were in an assembly line setting. That way the students also learned about the commercial side of a true factory type wood shop, instead of each student building his own desk. A real learning experience that probably could not happen now,

                • cwsmith
                  cwsmith commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Yep, that's how we approached that first semester desk project in my senior year (Class of 62'). Mr. Weaver, our woodshop teacher and Mr. Collins, our mechanical drawing teacher separately on the first day of school presented the project and the rules of the project to us. As I recall I had woodshop before mech drawing and Mr. Weaver explained that none of us were going to be making bowls for our mothers or gun racks for dear old dad, instead we were going to learn about jigs and fixtures and how to manufacture, our project was going to be a three drawer pedestal-like desk, with turned legs. He held up a picture and then said that we'd set up, build jigs, and then we'd each rotate through the various jobs including QC and supervision. When I got to mechanical drawing class, Mr. Collins had the same picture and told us our task was to draw up the components and assembly plans for it.

                  While we commenced to figure out the drawing phase, the woodshop class discussed the project, the tools we would use and of course safety in the shop. At the end of that, we took a field trip to a local furniture factory here in our area.

                  (My high school (Windsor) put a great amount of emphasis on "field trips" and over the course of four years History, English, Shop, and even Math classes took advantage of the field trip emphasis with visits too GE, IBM, Kroeler [sp?], National Homes, Cooperstown, as well as the Lake Champlain area with Ft. Ticonderoga, and other colonial sites. We even went to a Shakespeare festival and play [Macbeth] down in the Hudson Valley area. Windsor is just a small village about 17 miles east of Binghamon, but it has one of the best public highschools in the state. My wife went to one of the two Binghamton city highschools and never once had a field trip.)

                  So, while my shop class prepared, the mechanical drawing class made the blue prints with each pair of students drawing upt the plans for one component or another, including a little 'flyer' that we posted on the bulletin boards and handed out to neighbors and relatives. I can't remember the exact number we sold, but the number was in the 70's and we finished the project around Thanksgiving. Then we started preparing for the 'building' which would commence right after the new year.

                  Once we got our act together we commenced to cut, turn, sand and assemble, then stain and finish. IIRC, there were about six different stains a customer could choose from. The desk I took was ebony, and I had it for several years but left it home when I got married. I wish I had kept the drawing and flyer though, that would probably still be interesting.

                  In the second semester, with the desk project behind us, we took the two-bay garage plans from the previous shop class (class of 61'), modified it to a four room build with small bathroom and kitchenette. In late spring with all the fabrication done we took it outside of the village and erected it on a hill, where it became a radiio shack for the Northeast Miliary Affiliate Radio Service (MARS) of which our school principle was a director. I visited there a few times after highschool and in those years they passed a lot of traffic from both the middle east and Vietnam, Japan, etc. Most of that was messages home to parents in our region, either by phone patch or telegram-type messages to grateful parents.

                  Overall, it was a great learning experience and certainly my highschool well prepared me to work in industry. Although my plans were to have a military career, I was way under weight to pass the physical. I had spent a good share of that summer at Griffiss AFB in prep, but no dice. But in January I landed a job at a local factory, and because of my shop background and could read micrometers, calipers, etc. as well as blue prints, instead of working as an assembler, I was made an eletro-mechanical inspector. As I built on those experiences I went to night school to learn tool design and from there a technical illustrator and writer doing at first sub-contract work with IBM, I-R, GE, and others and then thirty years at Ingersoll- and Dresser-Rand, as well as continuing freelance work with Corning and several other industries across NY's southern tier.

                  I don't see that kind of prep or experience with young people today. I have two grandsons and between them and their many friends, I see lots of scholastic prep for college, but nothing in the way of practical mechanical or electronic abilities that would make for hiring without some extensive training on the job.

                  CWS

              • #11
                This thread made me think of a long-ago memory... As a teen, I saved up and bought an electric typewriter. (This was before the days of personal computers and printers). Not long after acquiring it, my mom asked if a friend of the family could borrow it (my parents had an old manual typewriter). So I agreed. What I didn't know was that the friend was typing a thesis (as in various drafts and then the final product). Much later I got my typewriter back. It was not as precise as it had been previously. It had seen industrial-grade use, but it was a consumer-grade item. It was clearly worn. My brand new typewriter was now well-used. It made me wonder why the friend didn't just buy one themselves. (The PhD candidate was a full-time employee, so he wasn't poor, and his employer was sponsoring the doctorate effort). It was like having just bought a new car and somebody borrowed it for a few months to transport things from coast to coast, returning the vehicle with 120,000 miles on it.

                Comment


                • cwsmith
                  cwsmith commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Too often that kind of thing seems to happen. It's like what, no manners, no sense of what's right? Even a year or so later the guy should have given it some thought and made it right with you, with at least a hardy thanks to show his appreciation for your help. I wonder if he ever gave it a thought, probably not.

                  I don't recall ever borrowing anything for anyone. A couple of years after we married, my wife was out shopping and as she backed out of one of those angular parking spaces, some guy ripped around the corner and hit our less-than-a-year-old car, damaging the trunk, bumper, and right-rear fender. I was at work when she called and my fellow worker immediately handed me the keys to his new Barracuda to I could get to the scene. Other than a little shook up, my wife was okay. I called Roger and told him that I'd be right back as soon as I took her home. He said he already arranged for his wife to pick him up, so keep the "cuda" and I'll get it as soon as you get a rental. Well, I got one the very next day, and then before I returned his car, I filled the tank and bought him a bottle of Chivas Regal Scotch.

                  Appreciation of someone's favor is always important!

                • capncarl
                  capncarl commented
                  Editing a comment
                  CW, that is how a lend should be handled, not returning a borrowed lawnmower with a rod sticking through the side of the block and commenting that it gaps the grass real bad!

              • #12
                My one BIL worked in the electrical trades all of his career and put his "mark" on all of his tools so they wouldn't "accidentally" take a walk. His mark was unique as the Smith & Wesson logo were his initials. Come to think of it, any tool I've put my mark on has always come home.
                Jim Frye
                The Nut in the Cellar.
                ”Sawdust Is Man Glitter”

                Comment


                • capncarl
                  capncarl commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Remember before the Internet when identical theft was unheard of? And everyone marked their stuff with their social security number? Good times they were!
                  When we were cleaning out my parents house I pulled the drawers of an old Chester drawers and every drawer had mommas ss# written in large magic marker….. now who worries about someone stealing their chester drawers?
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