PrimeGuard Ten Exterior Screws in Cedar

[wd4lc]

For a couple of outdoor projects (not a deck or anything that requires a lot of strength), I used primeguard ten exterior screws (grey labled box) as fasteners for joining cedar. I just now read that these screws "do not eliminate corrosion and/or staining due to various conditions such as high humidity, salt spray, and acidity content of preservatives in the wood (such as cedar, redwood, or man-made materials). Obviously I'm feeling like a real genius at this point.

Has anyone had any problems using this type of screw on cedar? Should I be all that concerned about fastener failure or staining...what kind of staining are we talking?
Doing some research it sounds like stainless steel or ceramic or vinyl coated are primary options for cedar. These seem to be more expensive options.
I'll be building this again and am wondering if I need to choose a new fastener or if I can stay with my current type.

Thanks.

[parnelli]

I'd switch to the Primeguard plus personally. There are green and tan ones.

I've got the tan ones on my cedar fence and the green ones on my deck which is PT.

I haven't had any staining problems- but I don't live by the ocean or anything...

As an aside, they used to include a square bit in the box, but my last package didn't have one. Saving money I guess...

[gerti]

Using Primeguard screws in a cedar fence I had weep stains within a few months despite being assured the opposite. Pulled them all and replaced with stainless, I will not use anything else anymore on Cedar.

[wd4lc]

Interesting. Split results it seems so far.

I looked at the variety of screws this evening at Lowes. I did see those PrimeGuard Plus (with Rustoleum). They did list a free bit (at least in the bigger buckets). Speaking of, is there actually any benefit between star, square and combo bits or is this just a way to identify the type of screw and/rating? Also is my assumption correct that those colors of screws are merely for aesthetics?

Reading over the Grip-Rite online catalog, they recommend only their stainless steel fasteners for cedar and redwoods. This was stated in the PrimeGuard Plus section.

I'm a bit torn here. Maybe there will be more input. For now I think I might go with the PrimeGuard Plus.

The cool thing is that after all of the research and input I have a better understanding of the differences in the coatings, electroplating, hot dip galvanization and stainless steel. In the catalog they also identified a handful of fasteners that I've seen before and have always wondered what the heck it was for and why it was shaped the way it was.

Thanks.

[radhak]

I have used the tan screws by DeckMate (Home Depot) and Phillips (Lowes, I think) on my Adirondack chair and an outdoor bench, and it has not seen any corrosion or staining from them, even after years of full exposure just as they guarantee on the box. Of course I finished over the screws and all, if that helps. It has been some years since I bought this but I recall that these were much cheaper than the stainless steel types.

What do Primeguard cost? You could try http://www.mcfeelys.com/exterior-deck-screws for more options. You could also check the site out for good help material. A lot of good stuff there. I put my address down and receive their brochure regularly. Apart from product listings it also has also answers all your questions and more.

I think the square bit is supposed to have a stronger grip than the star, and the combo is just one compatibility.

[JoeyGee]

I've also used the tan Deckmate screws and have not had any issues with them in any outdoor project that I have done in the past 3 years or so.

[wd4lc]

I have used the tan screws by DeckMate (Home Depot) and Phillips (Lowes, I think) on my Adirondack chair and an outdoor bench, and it has not seen any corrosion or staining from them, even after years of full exposure just as they guarantee on the box. Of course I finished over the screws and all, if that helps. It has been some years since I bought this but I recall that these were much cheaper than the stainless steel types.

What do Primeguard cost? You could try http://www.mcfeelys.com/exterior-deck-screws for more options. You could also check the site out for good help material. A lot of good stuff there. I put my address down and receive their brochure regularly. Apart from product listings it also has also answers all your questions and more.

I think the square bit is supposed to have a stronger grip than the star, and the combo is just one compatibility.

Thanks radhak. I checked out your mcfeelys link, browsed and they have a great FAQ. I read up on their square drives and apparently the drives reduce cam out (compared to a Philips head).

Reading some other discussions on the web it seems as though people are split between square and torx drive. Though I did just read one thread with many favoring torx/star.

Those primeguard plus were about $98 for a box of 25lbs at Lowes. That was 3" and I believe their catalog stated that the qty is about 73 pieces per pound.

Radhak and JoeyGee, were your projects made of cedar or a treated wood? Those types of fasteners are designed for treated woods. Natural cedar apparently has more tannins than other woods which cause the corrosion and discoloration. I think that is why they do not guarantee anything with the coated fasteners on cedar and redwood and therefore suggest stainless. Now they could work well enough on cedar but perhaps the company cannot put a guarantee on the box. Just curious if that is the case. Thanks.

[parnelli]

Interesting. Split results it seems so far.

I think Gerti was referring to the standard Primeguard and not the Plus version.

I'm pretty sure the box specifically mentioned cedar- otherwise I don't think I would have bought them.

I've also used the Deckmate ones mentioned above with no issues there either.

[wd4lc]

I think Gerti was referring to the standard Primeguard and not the Plus version.

I'm pretty sure the box specifically mentioned cedar- otherwise I don't think I would have bought them.

I've also used the Deckmate ones mentioned above with no issues there either.

I'll be checking them out again this evening. Last night, I did not see anything on the PP boxes that stated approval for cedar. Nothing on the boxes or signage and the associate was just as clueless as I was.

According to the catalog, their stainless steel line is also called primeguard plus. The griprite catalog specifically states...

"Only stainless steel is recommended for use with all
redwood and cedar projects, for marine projects, and
within five miles of coastline."

Perhaps when your project took place their standards were different and their PP "coated" products stated approval for cedar/redwood.

I guess I'll get their Plus coated and roll the dice.

[parnelli]

According to the catalog, their stainless steel line is also called primeguard plus. The griprite catalog specifically states...

"Only stainless steel is recommended for use with all
redwood and cedar projects, for marine projects, and
within five miles of coastline."

Perhaps when your project took place their standards were different and their PP "coated" products stated approval for cedar/redwood.

I guess I'll get their Plus coated and roll the dice.

I'm gonna vote that what that sentence means is that it's approved for:

cedar
redwood
marine
within 5 miles of a coastline

And that the coated are
cedar
redwood (guess on that one. Can't remember the last time I saw redwood)

and NOT marine or coastline.

[wd4lc]

Thank you for the help.

I did end up getting the Rustoleum coated and used them. I suppose time will only tell. I will say that the star bit was a pleasure to use. No cam out. Incredible.
I had actually read that Phillips head screws were actually invented to allow for cam out so that they would not be driven too far or recessed...something along those lines.

FTR, six days ago I emailed grip rite the same question about cedar and their coated screws but never got a response.