Smart plugs and why?

[cwsmith]

Personally, I don't like most of the electronics that is available. Our son has almost everything imaginable and he is visiting us for these two weeks... well, sort of visiting that is. Between his constant laptop, Alexa, and smartphone interactions it's a challenge to have a conversation with him. He's up here from New Orleans to help his mother while I have my scheduled surgery this Thursday. He brought us a set of four Google 'Nest Minis' that he thought we might enjoy. Yep, all the music, news, and Alexa conversations that anyone could want, plus more than I can imagine. Nice of him for sure, but solitude is nice too, and I am skeptical of how much eavesdropping may be possible.

I have that problem with the latest updates on my Fire Tablet too. Last week I discovered it was back and turned on. Several months ago or more I had removed it entirely, now it is back, unannounced and I have to 'force stop' it each and every time I turn the tablet on. I searched through the instructions and find no way to remove it.

We do have WiFi in the house and I'm pretty sure that is secure. But these other things bother me and I dislike the fact that any of them can be activated without my knowledge or control. Until I have a better understanding and complete control of when the devices are on or off, I won't be using them. So far, I find no assurances as to how much they might listen, monitor, or intrude on other devices like my home security system, WiFi, phone or whatever.

CWS

[atgcpaul]

I'm sure our Google Home mini hears everything although it's very selective about what it will answer. There are several times a conversation I've had with my wife shows up as a related news feed on my phone.

[Jshack01]

I have a smart outlet on my cordless tool battery charging station that turns it off at midnight every day. I used to have a voice activated switch for the dust collection vacuum, but although turning it on worked well, turning it back off again was an issue. Then I put it on a switch with a wireless remote control and that worked fine until I plugged a space heater into the second outlet and didn't realize it was now overloaded. I can still smell the faint odor of fried switch in the air out there. Oops.

[LCHIEN]

" I used to have a voice activated switch for the dust collection vacuum, but although turning it on worked well, turning it back off again was an issue. "

Is that because the vacuum noise made it hard for the controller to hear?

[Jshack01]

Yes, exactly

[leehljp]

I am not nearly as tech savvy in the details of programming (as I call it) as you guys. I am well aware of the depth of big brother (not just referring to our gov) has. When I lived in Japan, I helped our tech security guys on occasion and watched what was happening world wide. You guys may not think that much of the "Alexa" thing, but it has the potential for a depth that cannot be comprehended, or may not be thought of as important until it is too late - some 10 to 20 years down the road.

Security info from the early 2000's shortly after 911, but not related to 911 per se:

• In the late 90s, a native guy in the ministry in a large eastern country who had been imprisioned, and jailed several times for his "underground" work in homes - he escaped to a SE country by going through a port immigrations exit and never said a word even when asked. He just shrugged in answers to questions. Turns out he met a guy who was in on writing the initial system for the country - which happened to be a voice recognition system installed (mid-late 90s) similar to USA's gov cell phone listening system for radicals) that instantly recognized voice prints from millions of conversations simultaneously. Had he spoken at the port immigrations even one word, he would have been arrested immediately.

• Again late '90s, A ministry person working in a large south asian country went to a small country on the border of the large eastern country. Said person left laptop in the south country. No emails for 3 months on subject of travel. Passport was non-religious in nature. Stayed in small country for 3 to 4 weeks and went to the border of large country, presented non-religious passport, and was stopped. They were expecting said person and showed emails of intent to travel written 4+ months earlier.

• Mid-Late '90s - 2 health Workers of indirectly associated with health-humanitarian organization- traveled to a small easter asia country for health-humanitarian consultation. They took their lap tops. No email while there. Stayed a month. Left. Went to another country. Stayed a couple of weeks, went to another country. While two countries away, emailed their findings. Next day both killed. agent of country in need of humanitarian needs was recognized as being in their hotel the day they were killed.

• Early 2000's (not 911 related), information of emails, even supposedly secure, were popping up in a large eastern country. US security and Canadian security could never find the source. Finally, through google of an innocuous word, found connection to an east asian organization linked to another, linked to gov of said country. Break down was that they were years ahead of USA/Canada/Euro in surveillance.

This was REAL and in the mid-late '90s, early 2000's. What is it today. Do we not care? If you decide to travel 10 years from now, what you are doing and saying now can come back to haunt you/us.

I don't like the ads on my laptop or phone reflecting what I view or speak, an no, it is not porn.

[cwsmith]

Lee,

I totally agree with you. I am a trusting soul in my relationships with people, but in the last few years I've become much more cautious, and reviewing my previous 'trusting' nature as just being naive! Just this past year I've been disappointed in a couple of people's nature, twice!

But when it comes to electronic eavesdropping, I am highly suspicious of almost any and everything. When a thing like "Alexa" can turn itself on and off at someone else's will, activate your device's camera, microphone, and even look and copy files on the device, it can most likely even listen in our your other devices via you own LAN and router. That would mean that it can most likely read your keystrokes, copy your account numbers, e-mail, and even your daily routine, like what you watch, what you listen to, where you walk, drive or whatever. It would also have the capability to know what you spend and where you spend it. All under the guise of offering convenience and entertainment.

As mentioned earlier, my son just travelled up here from New Orleans. Before he left, he sent me a Google link that allowed me to track his path in real time. Pretty neat, and I could see not only his progress along the route, but also where he stopped and where he stayed. I could even see exactly what position he was in when he stopped in a restaurant, at a gas station, or went into store. While that was great fun, just imagine if a government agency or worse, some private enterprise was using that ability. All via your cell phone! You would have no way of knowing, you wouldn't know if your camera, your microphone, or the device itself was on or off. Even if you knowingly turned it off, how would you know it someone hadn't turned it back on, and did so in a manner that was hidden from the view panel???

So, by all means let's have a device in every room, in every car, and on every person in your household. Speak of something that someone, somewhere might not like, or might find useful or just might find interesting enough to file away for some future opportunity.

I have a book that I bought over a year ago. One that I haven't found the time to completely read yet, but it is interesting in its scope. "The Age of Surveillance Capitalism" by Shoshana Zuboff. It's 692 pages including the detailed Contents and Index, so not something I can get through in just a few nights, but something I really should dedicate some time too.

Years ago, actually decades, there was a story about the new Russian embassy that was built overlooking Silicon Valley which was the heart of personal computer development back in the 80's. The embassy was built up on a hill an had clusters of antenna's and a few 'dishes' that pointed down into the valley; sort of causing some wonder buy Apple and a few other R&D locations. As the story went, the Russians were actually able to read the keystrokes on many of those devices, thus copying a whole lot of research papers and reports that were being typed up.

You just never know,

CWS

[leehljp]

In my opinion, I don't think it (this surveillance) will hurt most people per se, but a persons ritual and occasional stop can be misinterpreted, a case can be brought against a person - 2, 3, 5 years down the road, or 30 years if in politics or a divorce break-up settlement. Innocuous things now become "evidence" later in trials or smear campaigns. These evidences are on a server somewhere and someone with tremendous skill or a lot of money can dig it up. If Someone doesn't like you, anything recorded/surveilled can be twisted against you, your family etc. The world has people who would do such things, and sometimes it could be the wealthy family of a spouse who would gladly give up a million dollars to a high tech private investigator to tear down their in-law in a divorce settlement. The (twisted) evidence is out there in Alexa and her kin.

[jabe]

Getting back to smart switches, I started to use Aqara products mainly because it's affordable and it works with all 3 smart assistant Apple Home Kit, Google & Alexa. Their G2H camera (looks like a minion) has Hub capability and can connect many different Aqara devices via Zigbee so no need to buy a separate Hub. I used Lutron Caseta smart switches with the PICO remote for my lights in my Kitchen, Living rm and master bdrm. as I wanted the dimmer capability. Needed to buy a Hub for the Lutron to work with your home network. The Lutron Caseta devices are pricey but can be used in 3-way switches without hard wiring. The Aqara switches can be used for 3 way applications without hard wiring also and it's cheaper, only thing it cannot be used as a dimmer. I used all the Lutron motion sensor light switches for all my bathrooms, pantry and tool room. I use Apple Home Kit as I was told it protected your personal information better than the others. But, if you use a cellphone or computer Big Brother is already monitoring you. Check out reviews on Aqara products on You tube and pricing on Amazon.

[atgcpaul]

Other than the one plug I am routinely using for the coffee maker, I found a use for the other plug. My kids' alarm clock broke, and I didn't want to buy another. I now have the smart plug controlling a radio to turn on and off at set times during the school week; it's off on the weekend, and unlike the old alarm, we don't have to remember to switch the alarm back on Sunday night.

Are any Hubitat users controlling their thermostat? Our house has a WiFi enabled Bryant Evolution Connex thermostat. The thermostat is nice with a touchscreen, and I can control the thermostat from anywhere using the Bryant app. The app is SO bad, though, as it doesn't seem to be optimized for phones, but larger tablets, and the desktop version (through HTTP) isn't great because it was using Adobe Flash which is disabled/removed in my browsers. However, I'm trying to do this on a limited budget so I'd rather not use an expensive Nest if there's another way.