A New Ryobi Tool

[woodturner]

Lithium rechargeable batteries are best stored and shipped at 70%, not full. The Battery University link above tells you that, and it's easy to research it to see that everyone agrees on that.

You are entitled to your opinions, but please understand that engineers and scientists designing batteries and battery-powered products, as well as the battery manufacturers and documented research, disagree with essentially everything you have posted.

We essentially disagree with everything you posted, so it's pointless to continue discussing it with you.

[Jim Frye]

Seems quite high in price.

Yeah, I thought that at first, but after a lot of research, it may not be so outrageous. The Troybilt TB30 E (30") lists for $2,499 also, but only runs for an hour. The CubCadet RZT™ S Zero Electric (42") also runs for just an hour also, but lists for $3,999. The closest Toro is a 42" gas engine powered model that lists for $3,400. There are a couple of rear engine gas riders that list for less than the RM480e, but they have 30" decks with a single blade and don't cut as well and are not as well built. These $1,400 to $1,900 mowers are certainly cheaper, but according to reviews, are not as robust as the Ryobi unit. My neighbor is going to be using a CubCadet CC30 rear gas engine manual transmission mower ($1,399) to mow his 90'x320' lot. The 30" mower is new and it will be interesting to see how well it holds up to the job. He's an engineer, so he knows how to care for stuff.

[Carlos]

I did not express any opinions, I'm just repeating what's well documented. The information is right there, you can go look it up (you even posted the link to the article saying the same thing I said). Although I should have added one detail; the BEST way to keep the longest total life is to store them at about 40%. However self-discharge makes that challenging. So 70% is used by my chargers as storage voltage. Maybe that's where you take exception? Dunno. Either way, storing them full is always bad.

3.85V
If left fully charged, the cells in a LiPo will unbalance quickly. Proper storage voltage for a LiPo is 3.85V per cell. Most LiPo chargers have a storage function that will either charge or discharge your battery until it hits 3.85V per cell.

This chart shows how much more damage is done to a fully charged battery in storage...

[Carlos]

Here's a start for your research:

[woodturner]

Yeah, I thought that at first, but after a lot of research, it may not be so outrageous. The Troybilt TB30 E (30") lists for $2,499 also, but only runs for an hour. The CubCadet RZT™ S Zero Electric (42") also runs for just an hour also, but lists for $3,999. The closest Toro is a 42" gas engine powered model that lists for $3,400.

Not an easy decision, is it? I've thought about a battery-powered mower but have not taken the leap. Please let us know what you decide, I'm curious where you will end up :-)

[WLee]

This chart shows how much more damage is done to a fully charged battery in storage...

Actually it shows the problem of HEAT, especially HIGH HEAT conditions.

Keep in mind the degrees in the LH column are Celsius/Centigrade, not Fahrenheit. The *major* degradation occurs when the batteries are stored fully charged somewhere "HOT" (40° C = ~104° F, and 60° C = ~140° F) -- the degradation is significantly less at anything humans consider "normal" (or "room") temperatures... i.e. 25° C = ~77° F.

So I suppose it depends on where you live (locale).

One should also note that *performance* of batteries is also somewhat "temperature dependent" -- it's sometimes referred to as the "Goldilocks" zone or syndrome/phenomenon (i.e. MOST battery chemistries -- both in term of lifespan AND performance -- are "good" only when the temperatures are neither too hot nor too cold, but "just right" in the middle -- coincidentally WE like the temps about the same {although arguably batteries are at there BEST, just a bit COOLER than we prefer}).

[Carlos]

That's another facet of it, but generally, we have less control over temperatures than we have over charge state. It's *easy* to pull batteries when done, or remember to not top them up all the time. But I'm unwilling to spend the effort to bring tools in from the garage every day. The rest of the batteries just sit in the house at room temp. So outside of freezing them, not storing them full is something you can do to preserve them. At room temp, you save about 15% of their life per year by not keeping them full.

[Jim Frye]

Not an easy decision, is it? I've thought about a battery-powered mower but have not taken the leap. Please let us know what you decide, I'm curious where you will end up :-)

A neighbor down the street recently purchased an eGo self propelled 60 volt walk behind and swears by it. He's a retired electrician, sohe's pretty savy on such things. He also drives a Cmax and hasa good handle on battery costs. We also have another neighbor that has a battery powwred walk behind and 2 years into ownership. He also swears by the technology.

[Jim Frye]

OK, today we took a drive the nearest HD that had a RM480e on the floor. 45 miles and an hour's drive up into Michigan. Ypsilanti to be exact. Hard to believe that the Toledo, OH area has no less than five HDs within 15 miles of my home and none have one of these after 18 months on the market. I asked the outdoor equipment guy at the Ypsilanti store why so few stores had this machine on the floor or in stock and he offered up a rather unique reasoning. The Ypsilanti store sits between the Eastern Michigan and the University of Michigan campuses. "Lots of tree huggers to make up a demographic that would buy such a machine". Anyway, it was everything that all of my research pointed to. Sitting among all of the traditional riders (both front and rear engined), it was as unique as the BT3000 was back in 1993. SWMBO sat on it, was struck by how small it was compared to the other riding mowers and even suggested an alternate storage area in the garage for the thing. I will be going over to the nearest HD next week and placing an order for one. I've been in contact with Ryobi to get answers to some of my questions that aren't addressed in the User Manual and so far, no bad answers. I also had a chat with the guy who lives behind me about his Toro Timecutter 42" mower. $3,400 new. Guess the Ryobi isn't overpriced after all. I'll update this after it gets delivered, assembled, and used a time or two. I'll also be comparing it to another neighbor's new rider. He's going to be mowing about 30,000 square feet (about 3/4 acre) with a CubCadet CC30 gasoline powered mower. Watching to see if it holds up like some of the reviews have stated.

[woodturner]

I will be going over to the nearest HD next week and placing an order for one.

A couple of suggestions to save you a few bucks:
1. buy it with HD gift cards you bought from a store that offers rewards. I think Kroger in your area still offers gas rewards when you purchase gift cards.
2. If you order in-store, ask for a 10% discount, HD and Lowes pretty much give anybody a 10% discount on request. If you are a vet, they also offer a 10% discount for vets.
3. Various reward referral sites offer rebates - so if you use their link and order online for in-store pickup you can get a rebate. Looks like the best rebate is 8% plus a $10 new account reward, but I don't know of a way to combine that with the 10% in-store discount.

[Jim Frye]

It's on its way! Before the trade war jacks the price up or makes it unavailable

08/13/18: I was puzzled by the apparent slowness of the shipping and finally logged into my HD account and opened a chat to get more details on my order. I ordered it on 08/06 and it shipped from the HD warehouse in Riverside, CA on 08/08. It's now traveling across the US to an LTL carrier near my home. Once it eventually gets there, they will set up delivery to my home.

08/14/18: It's at the LTL facility. Waitimg for delivery scheduling.

08/15/18: Delivery is scheduled for tomorrow!

[Jim Frye]

Delivered at 11:15 AM this morning and spent about 3 hours doing the final assembly. Backed it off of the steel frame pallet it was shipped on and ran it around the driveway. Gobs of torque! It was raining, so it was parked in the garage and plugged into the charger as it is supposed to be before the first mowing. This thing is STOUT!. All bolts and fastenings are oversized. Switch gear is also high quality. Full blown automotive style rack and pinion steering with adjustable ball joints on the tie rods. Automotive style spindles and king pins attached to a large front axle beam. And it's really pretty quiet.

[Carlos]

Oh yeah, the noise...never thought about that with an electric. Congrats, sounds like it will work for you forever.

[Jim Frye]

I've had this unit for six weeks now and I'd llike to lay out what I've learned. First off, it costs me about $0.06 in electricity to mow my lawn each time. I mow for 45 minutes to one hour and it uses less than 10% of the total charge capacity. Given the current cost of gasoline, I will have saved enough money in four years to pay for a total battery replacement. The mower is very maneuverable and it requires minimal trimming. Maintenance is limited to wiping out the underside of the mowing deck and plugging the mower into the čharger when it's not beîng used. This has been a great purchase experience.

[Carlos]

Excellent point on the cost savings, thanks for the update. Never thought about that. Nevermind all the cost and annoyance of carbs and other engine maintenance.