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  • vaking
    Veteran Member
    • Apr 2005
    • 1428
    • Montclair, NJ, USA.
    • Ryobi BT3100-1

    #16
    Originally posted by jimmy0x52
    I just can't imagine making that high of a car payment indefinitely. If cars aren't emotional you really should be getting into something that's far less expensive even on lease terms.
    Jimmy,
    Imagine that you are on the market for Accura TSX - the smaller of 2 Accuras available today. This car can be driven off the lot for $29K cash. Alternatively - Accura offers it with Accura financing at $500 a month for 60 months. Quick math says that 500X60=$30K, so you will pay $1000 in interest on roughly $30000 purchase over 5 years. That is 1.33% interest.

    And the same car is also offered at $300 a month lease. In 3 years you will pay 300X36=$10800.
    Which of the 3 options is the best is up to you. It all really depends on what your expectations of the future are.
    In my opinion - economy today is considered still weak and government estimate of inflation is low. Offered interest rate on Accura reflects this view. In reality economy is not that weak, I believe that by the time election time comes at the end of 2012 - economy shall be officially considered fully recovered and inflation numbers will be very different. So offered interest rate of 1.33% for five years I consider a good deal, so paying cash is not an option I would chose. And a lease that allows me to make use of a car during 3 years (and those are best and most trouble-free years for the car) while paying about 1/3 of a total car cost is also a valid option.

    As for "is $300 a month reasonable for a car?" - it all depends on a person. Surely there are cheaper cars, Accura TSX is what I would classify as "entry level luxury". Yes, you can get Civic for less but I don't fit well in civic and I don't like the ride in it either. I had cheap cars before, when you get older you are willing to pay for the comfort and quality of the ride, for the silence that comes with good sound insulation and suspencion. My current car is 10 years old Chevy Monte Carlo. Monte Carlo once was Chevy's version of a comfortable coupe. It was $23K MSRP 10 years ago when we bought it. Today it would have been about $30K factoring in inflation. I like the chevy and don't want to change the Monte Carlo but I don't expect 10 year old car to last much longer. I would be glad to buy Monte Carlo again but it had been discontinued. So I am looking for something in the similar price range. Accura is a valid candidate. And given the economic outlook, I think it might make sense for me to buy a car now rather than paying more a year later even though I think Chevy would still work fine for a year.
    Alex V

    Comment

    • Bruce Cohen
      Veteran Member
      • May 2003
      • 2698
      • Nanuet, NY, USA.
      • BT3100

      #17
      Originally posted by vaking
      Jimmy,
      In reality economy is not that weak, I believe that by the time election time comes at the end of 2012 - economy shall be officially considered fully recovered and inflation numbers will be very different.
      Alex,
      I don't know what planet you're living on, and although you're not too far from where I live, I think it still really sucks.
      I don't know where the Govt. is getting their numbers from, but I'm willing to bet they're coming out of someone's hat.

      Although your scenario seems to be spot on, I seriously doubt that's the case in reality.
      BTW, I am not dumping on you, just trying to correct a mind set some of us have been fed by the Govt.

      Bruce
      Last edited by Bruce Cohen; 03-12-2012, 11:34 AM.
      "Western civilization didn't make all men equal,
      Samuel Colt did"

      Comment

      • tommyt654
        Veteran Member
        • Nov 2008
        • 2334

        #18
        Where's my popcorn

        Comment

        • Russianwolf
          Veteran Member
          • Jan 2004
          • 3152
          • Martinsburg, WV, USA.
          • One of them there Toy saws

          #19
          Not to through a wrench into the calculations but I just went to the Acura site and the Ram Trucks site.

          Acura TSX

          Just over $30k
          Buy it for $579/mth for 60 months - 34,740
          Lease it for $556/mth for 36 months - 20,016

          Ram 1500 Laramie

          Just over $44k
          Buy it for $680/72mths - 48,960
          Lease it for $666/36mths - 23,976


          Now trade values.

          TSX 18-24k in my local for a 2008-2010 model.

          Ram 25-35k in my local for 2008-2010 models.

          So you are paying nearly as much for three years, and don't own squat at the end of the lease. If you can show me these places that are offering leases at half the prices of buying, I'm all ears. But Acura ain't one of them.
          Mike
          Lakota's Dad

          If at first you don't succeed, deny you were trying in the first place.

          Comment

          • cabinetman
            Gone but not Forgotten RIP
            • Jun 2006
            • 15218
            • So. Florida
            • Delta

            #20
            Originally posted by Russianwolf
            Not to through a wrench into the calculations but I just went to the Acura site and the Ram Trucks site.

            Acura TSX

            Just over $30k
            Buy it for $579/mth for 60 months - 34,740
            Lease it for $556/mth for 36 months - 20,016

            Ram 1500 Laramie

            Just over $44k
            Buy it for $680/72mths - 48,960
            Lease it for $666/36mths - 23,976


            Now trade values.

            TSX 18-24k in my local for a 2008-2010 model.

            Ram 25-35k in my local for 2008-2010 models.

            So you are paying nearly as much for three years, and don't own squat at the end of the lease. If you can show me these places that are offering leases at half the prices of buying, I'm all ears. But Acura ain't one of them.
            Lets assume for a moment that you want a new car every three years. You will have payments if you buy for 36 months. If you lease, you'll have payments for 36 months. You've already demonstrated that the payments are less when leasing (or total outlay).

            .

            Comment

            • vaking
              Veteran Member
              • Apr 2005
              • 1428
              • Montclair, NJ, USA.
              • Ryobi BT3100-1

              #21
              We must be looking at different places. This is what I see for Acura TSX.


              $299.00 per month for 36 months. $1,999.00 total due at signing.




              Includes down payment with no security deposit. Excludes taxes, titles and fees. For well-qualified lessees.
              Terms and Conditions: Closed-end lease for 2012 TSX 5 Speed Automatic vehicles (CU2F4CJW) available from March 1, 2012 through April 30, 2012, available to customers who qualify for the Acura Financial Services Super Preferred or Preferred credit tier. Not all lessees will qualify. Higher lease rates apply for lessees with lower credit ratings. MSRP $30,695.00 (includes destination, excludes tax, license, title fees, registration, documentation fees, options, insurance and the like). Actual net capitalized cost $28,109.09. Net capitalized cost includes $595 acquisition fee. Dealer contribution may vary and could affect actual lease payment. Total monthly payments $10,764.00. Option to purchase at lease end $18,417.00. Must take new retail delivery on vehicle from dealer stock by April 30, 2012. Lessee responsible for maintenance, excessive wear/tear and 15¢/mile over 10,000 miles/year for vehicles with MSRP less than $30,000, and 20¢/mile over 10,000 miles/year for vehicles with MSRP of $30,000 or more. See your Acura dealer for complete details.

              Expiration: 4/30/2012

              If you are buying, then 5% downpayment (about $1500) and $500 a month for 60 months.
              Alex V

              Comment

              • Mildoc
                Veteran Member
                • Jul 2011
                • 3118
                • Copperas Cove TX
                • BT

                #22
                Originally posted by jziegler
                Not always true. I drove off the lot with a brand new Prius (left over 2011) with 0% interest last weekend. There can be good specials offered sometimes.
                Pay the interest on a lease and NOT own the car? And get dinged for more $$$ if any dents, scratches, not "maintained," etc.?

                No thanks.
                We all have to go sometime, just not yet!

                Comment

                • Mildoc
                  Veteran Member
                  • Jul 2011
                  • 3118
                  • Copperas Cove TX
                  • BT

                  #23
                  Uh, did you leaver out the INITIAL payment. Never seen a lease without one.
                  We all have to go sometime, just not yet!

                  Comment

                  • Mildoc
                    Veteran Member
                    • Jul 2011
                    • 3118
                    • Copperas Cove TX
                    • BT

                    #24
                    Originally posted by cabinetman
                    Lets assume for a moment that you want a new car every three years. You will have payments if you buy for 36 months. If you lease, you'll have payments for 36 months. You've already demonstrated that the payments are less when leasing (or total outlay).

                    .
                    Yeah, some folks want a NEW car every 3 years. Not me. I prefer to put my extra "no payment cash" toward retirement. So, I am now comfortable in retirement.
                    We all have to go sometime, just not yet!

                    Comment

                    • Russianwolf
                      Veteran Member
                      • Jan 2004
                      • 3152
                      • Martinsburg, WV, USA.
                      • One of them there Toy saws

                      #25
                      After 3 years if you are "buying" you will have spent $20844 on the TSX and it is still worth $18k+. You owe about $12k on it. So you have $6k to roll into the next car. net is $14kish

                      Total 36 month outlay for the lease is $12763. IF you qualify for their terms.

                      I used 5% with no cash down for the loan above. If I drop the interest to their "Special" .9% rate for qualified buyers, the 36 month cost drops $2k ($18828). The difference between the two deals.


                      But lets say you want a new one at 2 years. If you buy you've spent $12552 and its valued at $24k. You owe about $20k and you have $4k to roll.

                      If you leased (closed end lease), You've paid $9175 (if you have excellent credit to qualify for their special rate) and you have to pay to get out of the lease. You are likely going to roll a negative number into the new lease.

                      Life changes. Situations change, if you are buying it allows you a lot more options. Unless you are buying something that you really can't afford in the first place, you should never be underwater on a car (meaning the trade value should always be more than what you owe).
                      Mike
                      Lakota's Dad

                      If at first you don't succeed, deny you were trying in the first place.

                      Comment

                      • Bruce Cohen
                        Veteran Member
                        • May 2003
                        • 2698
                        • Nanuet, NY, USA.
                        • BT3100

                        #26
                        Leasing pit-fall

                        While just about every dealer includes "Gap" insurance (the difference between what you owe and the book value if the car is totaled. What most dealer's don't tell you is that all the money placed "up-front" to lower the monthly's, whish is usually $25.00 less per month in payments, is not recoverable if you have a total loss.
                        Considering the original reason for a lease, retaining as much liquid cash as possible, I am always surprised when someone puts down like $4,000.00 to reduce the payment.
                        I've been leasing cars for over 25 years and always go for the smallest cash payment at onset as possible. Not just to keep as liquid as possible (read that as my tool addiction), but to avoid an unrecoverable loss of funds in case of a total loss, be it accident or theft.
                        This is another thing to take into account is you want to lease.
                        Additionally, I don't put too many miles on my cars, so i don't have to worry about the extra milage charges, whick is usually what a rental car costs.

                        Bruce

                        BTW, For me, leasing is still the way to go. I hate driving clunkers and paying for repairs after the warranty runs out.
                        Last edited by Bruce Cohen; 03-14-2012, 10:30 AM. Reason: Still don't know how to type or spell
                        "Western civilization didn't make all men equal,
                        Samuel Colt did"

                        Comment

                        • jziegler
                          Veteran Member
                          • Aug 2005
                          • 1149
                          • Salem, NJ, USA.
                          • Ryobi BT3100

                          #27
                          Originally posted by mildoc
                          Pay the interest on a lease and NOT own the car? And get dinged for more $$$ if any dents, scratches, not "maintained," etc.?

                          No thanks.
                          Not a lease, a loan. 0%, nothing down, own the car at the end.

                          Comment

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